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Old 05-05-2011, 11:13 AM   #1
Slaven
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Post [Scourge/Agi] Rebellion - Bandit







version

Rebellion
Bandit


18+1.8
23+2.4
16+2.2

 
______________
Affiliation:Scourge
Damage:53-59
Armor:3.2
Movespeed:305
Missle speed:1200
Attack Range:380
Starting HP/MP:492/256
Sight range:1800/800





All suggestions are welcome.
If you like this hero, T-Up.
If you don't like this hero because there are some minor problems or flaws, you can T-Null and state the problem and i will address it.
If you don't like this hero at all and and see many major problems with it, you can T-Down.
If you have any ideas,suggestions or even criticisms with reasons to improve this hero, i will consider them.
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Last edited by Slaven; 07-30-2012 at 10:22 AM. Reason: Update
Old 05-05-2011, 07:14 PM   #2
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Default Re: In progres - Shadowboxer

you have seven spells there is only enough room for 6
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Old 05-05-2011, 07:23 PM   #3
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Default Re: In progres - Shadowboxer

Add another simple attack modifier(short cooldown, low mana cost, small damage increase) instead of garrote, it would add combo points(up to 5)
and kidney shot instead of vanish, stun duration based on combo points.
Ambush can be automatically triggered when you break stealth from behind cos it aint an ambush if the enemy expects it.
way too confusing

Quote:
Note: Shadow Stealth is disabled in combat for 4 seconds.
u mean like kelen's dagger or hearth of tarrasque?

Edit after seeing your third: nvm
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Old 05-06-2011, 08:08 AM   #4
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Default Re: In progres - Shadowboxer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrooks View Post
you have seven spells there is only enough room for 6
??? where you see 7 spells??? U didn't even read it, did you?
One skill give 3 active skills, and 3 skills which are for them self.




Quote:
Originally Posted by O_xD View Post
Add another simple attack modifier(short cooldown, low mana cost, small damage increase) instead of garrote, it would add combo points(up to 5)
and kidney shot instead of vanish, stun duration based on combo points.
Ambush can be automatically triggered when you break stealth from behind cos it aint an ambush if the enemy expects it.
way too confusing


u mean like kelen's dagger or hearth of tarrasque?

Edit after seeing your third: nvm

I where thinking about that stile, what is really in WoW, that thing with combo points, but i am not sure that there is possible to make adding combo points in wc3. Even if it is possible to do it, i am not sure that its possible to make skill that have effect based on combo points.

And ambush, if i put that he is triggering from behind it will be too similar to riki's backstab, so i can only change name so it don't be "ambush".

ambush(backstab), garrote(rupture), kidney shot(cheap shot), poisons, vanish, and stealth.

I add only base skill that u use mostly with rogue in WoW.
I won't chance anything now
When i finish it i will start making changes.

And stealth disable, its like dagger.
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Old 05-06-2011, 01:29 PM   #5
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Default Re: In progres - Shadowboxer

He's OP...
and make his 1st skill his ulti, then change the ulti, it's useless cause u already have skill2, why have 2 invisible skill?
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Old 05-06-2011, 05:13 PM   #6
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Default Re: In progres - Shadowboxer

Quote:
Originally Posted by tusuksate View Post
He's OP...
and make his 1st skill his ulti, then change the ulti, it's useless cause u already have skill2, why have 2 invisible skill?
Its still in progress, balance would be done later.
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Old 05-12-2011, 03:41 PM   #7
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Default Re: Shadowboxer - Brigand

Its done, give a comment please
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Old 05-15-2011, 05:06 PM   #8
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Default Re: Shadowboxer - Brigand

Update:

-Sneaky:
*Sneaky ability don't give agility to Shadowboxer when enemy hero die, anymore.
*Sneaky ability increase vision while Shadowboxer is invisible.
-Envenom poison:
*If enemy hero die while he poisoned Shadowboxer permanently steal 1 agility.
-Deadly throw:
*Deadly throw is now thrown in Shadowboxer's direction.
*If spear hit enemy from back it deal 100/200/300 bonus damage instead of 2x damage.
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Old 05-15-2011, 05:41 PM   #9
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Default Re: Shadowboxer - Brigand

This hero reminds me of mine, they have similar skills, however i didn't steal any, so don't get all angry at me

Anyway, nice hero, heres a short review:

1st skill: Nice, but not really practical for offense, and thats where hero shines. I mean you make gap between yourselves wider, letting enemy escape easier. I guess it was mean to push close enemies away, to get few more shots before they come in, but really thats an escape skill.

2nd skill: Similar to Rexxars owl invis and Lanayas meld, but its cool.

3rd skill: I really like this one! We got str steal (pudge), int steal (nort), and no agi steal . Well slark isn't counted, he doesn't permanently steal...

4th skill: Huge range, imba damage from back, and low cooldown. Only spell i dont like here. I mean every 10 seconds, you get an omgwtfggwp spear with Laguna blade damage (when farmed up, and stolen lots of agi), and it has range like Leonidas spear that harmed that Persian guy, forgot his name...

Also 1 more thing i don't like it - he was supporsed to be based on stealth, not DPS imho.

Overall T-up on hero!
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Old 05-15-2011, 06:51 PM   #10
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Default Re: Shadowboxer - Brigand

i don't like the name
rest is ok
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Old 05-15-2011, 06:55 PM   #11
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Default Re: Shadowboxer - Brigand

Shield Bash - Seem to synergyze well with Ultimate (Cleaning vision for the target), although I'd say it's a bit too riksy for a ranged character to charge in just to deal some bonus damage, although, if you made it to be a gamble, then ignore this comment.

Sneaky - This is one skill I can't seem to find what is it use in this hero. While it grants invisibility, it costs mobility, which makes it a bad choice on a hero who got to land skill shots (Deadly Throw). Sure the bonus vision is great and so is the "wind walk" effect when you start moving (it helps to set a deadly throw), but in the end you need to be standing still for 1.75 seconds, that's like you've been hit by a magic missile every time you used this skill, and is pretty annoying to do that when you are moving around to land a skillshot on the enemy.

Envenom Poison - Ugh, does this skill poison every time the target is hit, or is it only a minor chance? A certain drow ranger would be mad at this. The Agi bonus is pretty huge, and the so is the slow (at level 1 50% movement slow?). I'd say tone it down a bit, enough to make it hard to flee but still possible.

Deadly Throw- Seems kinda good, I'll do some mathematic just to check if the damage is groundbreaking or not:
Lvl 8 - Max Current Poison and Spear Throw Level 1
Not From Back =126 | Back = 226
Lvl 13 - Max Current Poison and Spear Throw Level 2
Not From Back = 233 | Back = 433
Lvl 18 - Max Current Poison and Spear Throw Level 3
Not From Back = 276 | Back = 576

No items are taken in account. With a Eaglehorn, Agi Treads and 3 Wraith:

Lvl 18 - Max Current Poison and Spear Throw Level 3
Not from Back = 436 | Back 736

Seems it scale pretty well if you actually start farming up the agility and agility items, but it would be better if it started stronger and the scalability was lower, currently I'm not sure if it is a good idea add a hard to land skill who deal only 126 damage if you aren't chasing someone at early game levels.
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Old 05-15-2011, 09:00 PM   #12
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Default Re: Shadowboxer - Brigand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterja View Post
This hero reminds me of mine, they have similar skills, however i didn't steal any, so don't get all angry at me

Anyway, nice hero, heres a short review:

1st skill: Nice, but not really practical for offense, and thats where hero shines. I mean you make gap between yourselves wider, letting enemy escape easier. I guess it was mean to push close enemies away, to get few more shots before they come in, but really thats an escape skill.

2nd skill: Similar to Rexxars owl invis and Lanayas meld, but its cool.

3rd skill: I really like this one! We got str steal (pudge), int steal (nort), and no agi steal . Well slark isn't counted, he doesn't permanently steal...

4th skill: Huge range, imba damage from back, and low cooldown. Only spell i dont like here. I mean every 10 seconds, you get an omgwtfggwp spear with Laguna blade damage (when farmed up, and stolen lots of agi), and it has range like Leonidas spear that harmed that Persian guy, forgot his name...

Also 1 more thing i don't like it - he was supporsed to be based on stealth, not DPS imho.

Overall T-up on hero!
Thank you on T-up
but Deadly Throw not so imba, its not direct spell, its thrown in direction of Shadowboxer.
So anyway it can hit a creep on its way,
BTW Shield Bash is there to help about aiming with ultimate.
Who told you that he was supposed to be based on stealth?
U maybe read this when it was still in progress when it had 2 invisibility skills.
I think this is better there is a lot heroes based on stealth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by usilorso View Post
i don't like the name
rest is ok
I like name.
If you don't u shall suggest new one and i will think to maybe change it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Labyrinth Suite View Post
Shield Bash - Seem to synergyze well with Ultimate (Cleaning vision for the target), although I'd say it's a bit too riksy for a ranged character to charge in just to deal some bonus damage, although, if you made it to be a gamble, then ignore this comment.

Sneaky - This is one skill I can't seem to find what is it use in this hero. While it grants invisibility, it costs mobility, which makes it a bad choice on a hero who got to land skill shots (Deadly Throw). Sure the bonus vision is great and so is the "wind walk" effect when you start moving (it helps to set a deadly throw), but in the end you need to be standing still for 1.75 seconds, that's like you've been hit by a magic missile every time you used this skill, and is pretty annoying to do that when you are moving around to land a skillshot on the enemy.

Envenom Poison - Ugh, does this skill poison every time the target is hit, or is it only a minor chance? A certain drow ranger would be mad at this. The Agi bonus is pretty huge, and the so is the slow (at level 1 50% movement slow?). I'd say tone it down a bit, enough to make it hard to flee but still possible.

Deadly Throw- Seems kinda good, I'll do some mathematic just to check if the damage is groundbreaking or not:
Lvl 8 - Max Current Poison and Spear Throw Level 1
Not From Back =126 | Back = 226
Lvl 13 - Max Current Poison and Spear Throw Level 2
Not From Back = 233 | Back = 433
Lvl 18 - Max Current Poison and Spear Throw Level 3
Not From Back = 276 | Back = 576

No items are taken in account. With a Eaglehorn, Agi Treads and 3 Wraith:

Lvl 18 - Max Current Poison and Spear Throw Level 3
Not from Back = 436 | Back 736

Seems it scale pretty well if you actually start farming up the agility and agility items, but it would be better if it started stronger and the scalability was lower, currently I'm not sure if it is a good idea add a hard to land skill who deal only 126 damage if you aren't chasing someone at early game levels.
I like this type of comment, when guy really read a tread.

Shield bash- maybe u didn't notice but he knock back self also, so he isn't near enemies.

Sneaky- at start Deadly throw had a cast time, and i decided to remove it, cuz its to similar to Sniper's ult.
But its mostly to help you with aiming or when you go to gank sm1 (stay in wood till you get invisibility then go on)
There where also ideas about: *unstoppable vision instead of bonus vision.
If you think that unstoppable vision is better than bonus vision pls say it...

Envenom - Chance is 30/40/50/60 but i will listen you and remove it on 17% on all levels and increase duration from 3 sec on all levels to 3/4/5/6 sec

Deadly throw - (envenom lvl 4)
U didn't count agility that he get per level (2.9 agility per level)
so:
lvl8: 73 agility - 146 damage ˇ/ 246 from back
with agi treads and 2x wraith band :
93 agility - 186 damage / 286 from back
lvl11: 82 agility - 246 damage / 446 from back
with agi treads and 2x wraith band and lets says yasha
118 agility - 354 damage / 554 from back
lvl16: 96 agility - 384 damage / 684 from back
with agi treads 2x WB yasha and lets says eaglehorn
147 agility - 588 damage / 888 from back

seems balanced but still with this much low cooldown its pretty imba
i will increase cooldown, and put rescal 2/3/4x to 3/3.5/4x the agility.

THANK YOU MAN ON THIS COMMENT U OPENED MY EYES
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Old 05-15-2011, 09:04 PM   #13
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Default Re: Shadowboxer - Brigand

Update:

Update based on comments:
Envenom:
Duration rescaled from 3 to 3/4/5/6 seconds
Chance reduced from 30/40/50/60 to 17% on all levels
Deadly throw:
Cooldown rescaled from 10 to 30/25/20 seconds.
Damage rescaled from 2/3/4x the agility to 3/3.5/4x agility.
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Old 05-16-2011, 12:17 AM   #14
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Default Re: Shadowboxer - Brigand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slaven View Post
Shield bash- maybe u didn't notice but he knock back self also, so he isn't near enemies.
Shield Bash - My bad, haven't taken account he would be at his max range at any time (380), seems great. Does the knockback have travel time or is it isntant like Flamebreak?

Quote:
Sneaky- at start Deadly throw had a cast time, and i decided to remove it, cuz its to similar to Sniper's ult.
But its mostly to help you with aiming or when you go to gank sm1 (stay in wood till you get invisibility then go on)
There where also ideas about: *unstoppable vision instead of bonus vision.
If you think that unstoppable vision is better than bonus vision pls say it...
Unstoppable Vision is a area where you don't really want to mess with, if it is anything big it will be too much and if it is too small it can't be made useful. One of Balanar good points is the fact he cant be ganked because of unblocked sight (only at Night), and he requires a Aghanim to do it so.
Although I'm not saying it is impossible to implement it without being too game breaking, there gotta be a point where it is useful and not strong, but my only issue with this skill is the fact you gotta stand still to make it work, I'm sure the problem is regarding Rikimaru ultimate who would be weak if you didn't add the fade, but you could make the bad effect something else instead.

Standing still on a hero with skillshot and with such short range is hard.

Quote:
Envenom - Chance is 30/40/50/60 but i will listen you and remove it on 17% on all levels and increase duration from 3 sec on all levels to 3/4/5/6 sec
It is still pretty strong. 30 Agility is the amount Drow Ranger obtain from the second tier of her Ultimate, and while this restricts you to hit one target to get the bonus, it's not like you'd be trying to hit various targets anyway. (Not counting with possible 1 Agility you will gain per gank in the game, if not more since it only requires his target to be poisoned)

6 second 50% slow is extremely strong too, it basically makes him able to kite even a Thristy Strygwyr. You should definetly tone it down, the chance you add on the skill to trigger shouldn't make it extremely powerful when it lands and useless when it doesn't, that just end in people stacking attackspeed (Like MoM Baratrums/Faceless Voids) instead of the real role of the hero (who seems to be pinpointing, poisoning then throwing spears at a specified target).

You should make it a higher chance, but small duration, reasonable slow (25~40%, and just for reference, Gondar's Jinada is 25% slow while Drow's Arrow is 40%), keep some minor bonus agility with some agility gain, but not enough to make some other character ultimate seem stupid (he got a pretty big Agility growth already).

Quote:
Deadly throw - (envenom lvl 4)
U didn't count agility that he get per level (2.9 agility per level)
so:
lvl8: 73 agility - 146 damage ˇ/ 246 from back
with agi treads and 2x wraith band :
93 agility - 186 damage / 286 from back
lvl11: 82 agility - 246 damage / 446 from back
with agi treads and 2x wraith band and lets says yasha
118 agility - 354 damage / 554 from back
lvl16: 96 agility - 384 damage / 684 from back
with agi treads 2x WB yasha and lets says eaglehorn
147 agility - 588 damage / 888 from back

seems balanced but still with this much low cooldown its pretty imba
i will increase cooldown, and put rescal 2/3/4x to 3/3.5/4x the agility.
I counted the base agility+growth, I just didn't count items with it (just for the sake of simplicity).

Actually I was thinking the cooldown was fine and all it needed was a better scaling. The problem is that you are balancing it along the idea that every throw will be a hit, but since this is a "aim and shoot" skill, there are gonna be quite a small number of hits (probably next to the amount of good PotM arrows, unless you forgot to tell it doesn't hit creeps) and even lower amount of hits from behind. For me the problem it had was regarding the initial damage (which was too low) but you fixed it now.

I'm not with the head to do mathcrafting now but IIRC all heroes have a inert 25% Resistance to spelldamage, so you have to consider that in the values of the nuke.

(Now noticing, Making Ethereal Blade on him would make nuking enemies a easy trick since most people try to run back when afflicted by with Ethereal, it makes target take higher spell damage and slow it considerably)
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Old 05-16-2011, 04:21 PM   #15
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

^
Sneaky:
Yea, i agree with your comment about it. I also don't like to much this skill, but IMO this hero need some type of wind walk, but i don't want to be to similar to already existing invisibilities.
So if you have idea, i am here to listen you....
Envenom poison:
3 sec duration on all levels;
chance 10/15/20/25%
slow 30%
agility 5/10/15/20 (Trax agility bonus is 15, but its passive so i think passive 15 agility is better than this)

Do you agree with this? is it balanced?
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Old 05-17-2011, 12:58 AM   #16
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slaven View Post
^
Sneaky:
Yea, i agree with your comment about it. I also don't like to much this skill, but IMO this hero need some type of wind walk, but i don't want to be to similar to already existing invisibilities.
So if you have idea, i am here to listen you....
Add something that allows him to position himself easy after closing gap with Shield Bash, since your character is going to have to autoattack a bit before launching a spear to apply the poison, how about it works like "After X attacks" (like old Storm passive) or "Every X seconds your next attack" (Kunkka and Gondar passive) but it makes you invisible, high MS, phase units and have sight of your target for a short while, like, 6 seconds? It would allow you to reposition yourself, know where your target is and launch a perfect Deadly Throw/Shield Bash at him.

This is only a suggestion I'm making, if this doesn't go the same way you want the hero to be played as, just try to think of something who would support that gameplay the same way you want it to be.

Quote:
Envenom poison:
3 sec duration on all levels;
chance 10/15/20/25%
slow 30%
agility 5/10/15/20 (Trax agility bonus is 15, but its passive so i think passive 15 agility is better than this)

Do you agree with this? is it balanced?
Much better.
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Old 05-17-2011, 01:12 AM   #17
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

his third skill is way too strong 30 bonus agi at level 7? are u on crack?
his ult is also pretty imba strong... unless you make it physical damage then it might scale well.
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Old 05-17-2011, 07:37 AM   #18
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Update:

Update based on comments:
Envenom poison:
Duration reduced from 6/5/4/3sec to 3 sec
chance reduced from 30/40/50/60% to 25%
Agility bonus reduced from 15/20/25/30 to 5/10/15/20
Slow reduced from 50% to 20/25/30/35%
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Old 05-17-2011, 07:44 AM   #19
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Quote:
Originally Posted by MassBalance View Post
his third skill is way too strong 30 bonus agi at level 7? are u on crack?
his ult is also pretty imba strong... unless you make it physical damage then it might scale well.
I just reduced his third skill.
and BTW we where counting ult's damage, its not that much imba strong... and also its hard to hit enemy cuz it can hit creep, and targeting type is instant like targeting at shadowraze...
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Old 05-25-2011, 05:56 PM   #20
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Update:

Update:
•Shield bash update:
-note updated.
•Sneaky update:
-Sneaky is now active spell.
-Sneaky now give invisibility as active spell.
-Sneaky now give agility bonus to shadowboxer while invisible and few seconds after braking invisibility:
agility: 5/10/15/20 while invisible and 2/3/4/5 seconds after braking invisibility.
-Sneaky don't give vision bonus anymore.
-note updated.
•Envenom poison update:
-Envenom poison don't give agility bonus anymore.
-Envenom poison silence for 1 second every time when shadowboxer apply it.
-note update.


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Old 06-20-2011, 09:44 AM   #21
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Update:

•Hero name is changed.
•Added Hero Background story.
•Added Hero Introduction.


Share your opinion about thread
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Old 06-20-2011, 09:51 AM   #22
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Iconset looks....... stupid.
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Old 06-24-2011, 06:38 PM   #23
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fade2black.Go View Post
Iconset looks....... stupid.
I agree but what to do can't find other icons
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Old 06-27-2011, 10:48 AM   #24
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Update:

Update:
•Icon set update(new):
-Old Icon set:
Shield bash Sneaky Envenom poison Deadly Throw
-New Icon set:
Shield Bash Sneaky Crippling Poison Deadly Throw
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Old 06-27-2011, 11:21 AM   #25
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

T-Null, cause it looks messy
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Old 06-30-2011, 08:16 PM   #26
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phoenix7937 View Post
T-Null, cause it looks messy
Any suggestions for improving? to be neater
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Old 01-13-2012, 03:11 PM   #27
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Hey guys i just updated all skill so i want to ask do you like
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Old 01-15-2012, 09:20 PM   #28
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

He needs some tweaks, dunno exactly what to change but imo:

90% MR is too much. MR stacks deminishingly, so around 70 would be enough.

Again, -20%mr is too much. I would leave it at 15%. Ms is ok, even though would be better to reduce since you got a chase mechanism with low cd.

I didn't understand "Knock back self and nearly enemies" in the first skill. Like, he charges the target, but when he reachs he gets knocked back?

I think it would be better if he charges, and when he reaches the target, he knock back enemies in the aoe, but pull himself and the target. I think it would fit the shield idea of the skill. Like it bashes and then "protect", like a shield, you and the enemy target.

Rest is fine, i guess. Liked the permanent agi stealer. Ult is good. gj
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:05 PM   #29
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Quote:
Originally Posted by xitadon View Post
He needs some tweaks, dunno exactly what to change but imo:

90% MR is too much. MR stacks deminishingly, so around 70 would be enough.

Again, -20%mr is too much. I would leave it at 15%. Ms is ok, even though would be better to reduce since you got a chase mechanism with low cd.

I didn't understand "Knock back self and nearly enemies" in the first skill. Like, he charges the target, but when he reachs he gets knocked back?

I think it would be better if he charges, and when he reaches the target, he knock back enemies in the aoe, but pull himself and the target. I think it would fit the shield idea of the skill. Like it bashes and then "protect", like a shield, you and the enemy target.

Rest is fine, i guess. Liked the permanent agi stealer. Ult is good. gj

I love when some really read thread and leave true comment.

Imo 90% resistance isn't to much becouse its only for 5 secs.... naix's skill is much better he is completle immune on magics and gain extra attack speed while here at 90% MR he will probably block all magical damage but he can still be slowed stuned webed and all other stuffs. Anyway i rescaled it to 40/50/60/70%

And poison stuff, yea when you see -20% magical resistance that look pretty strong but there is 20% chance to apply poison so it isn't....
Anyway i changed skill increase chance and making poison stackable so now at lvl 4 it can be up to -15% MR.

and you understand first skill.... but i won't change it becouse pulling enemy would be too similar to hook, and at low pulling range it would be useless, and at high pulling range it would be too OP skill.
anyway like this, you clear way to your target for your ult, and also knockback self is 380 range what is equal to hero's attack range.

also i reduced movement speed to 305
that all some minor changes but check em
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Old 01-16-2012, 03:11 PM   #30
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

Oh, i get the first skill now... i forgot he is ranged ;P

T-up, i'll check the minor changes later.
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Old 01-16-2012, 04:55 PM   #31
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi]Shadowboxer - Brigand

thanks on support
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Old 01-24-2012, 12:44 PM   #32
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi] Shadowboxer - Bandit

Update:
Old skill -Envenom Poison-
Quote:
Kassan is master of poisons. Every attack have chance to apply poison. Poison reduce enemies movement speed by 10% and magical resistance by 5%. If enemy hero died while he poisoned, Kassan steal permanently agility.
changed to -Envenom Poison- (new)
Quote:
Poison reduce enemies movement speed by 10%. If Kassan reach poison cap he silence enemy for 5 seconds and gain bonus agility for 5 seconds. If enemy hero died while he poisoned, Kassan permanently steal 1 agility.
Poison cap rescaled from 2/2/3/3 to 2/3/4/5
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Old 01-27-2012, 06:05 PM   #33
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi] Shadowboxer - Bandit

Update:
Quote:
Two new skills;
Old skills:
Cloack of Shadow

Cover Kassan with a Cloak of Shadow increasing his magial resistance for short period. All physical damage he take while under Cloak of Shadow will recover his mana.

Envenom Poison

Poison reduce enemies movement speed by 10%. If Kassan reach poison cap he silence enemy for 5 seconds and gain bonus agility for 5 seconds. If enemy hero died while he poisoned, Kassan permanently steal 1 agility.

-New skills are:
Negative Energy&Vindicta
-New ult's icon.
-Hero introduction updated to current skills.
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Last edited by Slaven; 01-27-2012 at 06:31 PM.
Old 02-06-2012, 08:26 AM   #34
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi] Shadowboxer - Bandit

Update:

update:
•Stats:
-Strenght gain per level decresed to 1.8
-Agillity gain per level increased to 2.4
•Shield bash:
-Nearly enemies now take 50% of damage that primary target take.
•Vindicata:
-Damage rescaled:
-for creeps from 50/80/115/150 to 20/40/55/70
-for heroes from 100/150/200/250 to 50/100/150/200
•Deadly Throw:
-Targeting type is now "point"
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Old 02-07-2012, 03:40 AM   #35
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi] Shadowboxer - Bandit

T-Null

Aight, so basically:
1st skill - Anti gank initiator.

2nd skill - Prolly target some fragile, non-spell dependent agility hero. Though, I would prefer the damage to be pure though, easily countered by alert people.

3rd skill - I want to stress more on this, first of all : is the damage dealt passively or requires hitting the active sub-skill?
If active, then I would like to suggest a limit to the number of souls cause I won't want some big mean mother hubbard dealing 5000 damage out of the blue accumulating all those kills.
If passive then I don't even...

Ultimate - Main nuking skill that can potentially deal a heckload of damage with Mirana-arrow-concept target point and...what do we have here, 5 seconds cooldown. Lol, yeah the 200 extra mana thing sorts of balance it out, but there's....I dunno, something seems wrong about it. Seems easy to overcome with 2nd skill and some items, seeing as Kassan doesn't have a lame INT build.

All in all, pretty unique, at the same time pretty generic. Well, all I can say, cheers.
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Old 02-07-2012, 04:29 PM   #36
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi] Shadowboxer - Bandit

There's no clear synergy in his skills (I think?). The shield bash is just odd, I don't get why the target and I must be knock back after the duration of the spell. Is it because it offer as an escape mechanism? It only level for the sake of damage. Why not prolonged the stun per level? For me the stun is ok but for the knockback ehhh no.


I have a question about the 2nd skill. Can I deny my allies with that skill?


I like the 3rd skill and the Ulti, but why not have a damage cap for the 3rd skill?

Overall: T-Null
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Old 02-07-2012, 06:02 PM   #37
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi] Shadowboxer - Bandit

Quote:
Originally Posted by deathkidkun View Post
T-Null

Aight, so basically:
1st skill - Anti gank initiator.

2nd skill - Prolly target some fragile, non-spell dependent agility hero. Though, I would prefer the damage to be pure though, easily countered by alert people.

3rd skill - I want to stress more on this, first of all : is the damage dealt passively or requires hitting the active sub-skill?
If active, then I would like to suggest a limit to the number of souls cause I won't want some big mean mother hubbard dealing 5000 damage out of the blue accumulating all those kills.
If passive then I don't even...

Ultimate - Main nuking skill that can potentially deal a heckload of damage with Mirana-arrow-concept target point and...what do we have here, 5 seconds cooldown. Lol, yeah the 200 extra mana thing sorts of balance it out, but there's....I dunno, something seems wrong about it. Seems easy to overcome with 2nd skill and some items, seeing as Kassan doesn't have a lame INT build.

All in all, pretty unique, at the same time pretty generic. Well, all I can say, cheers.
1)For ult i where thinkin' that cast be instant in direction he face... like nevermore's, but that will be extremly hard to utilize and this first skill would be come synergy with ult, becouse it will leave clear path for your ult, now its same, just ult is easier to utilize.

2) In my brain i have its style like similar to bloodseekers bloodrage, but different is huge.
in early game cast on enemies at late game on self/friends

3) This spells is passive but dmg randomly hit enemies, sub skill is for focus, so dmg hit only focused unit..
about dmg limit, i where also thinkin' its pretty imba if you have some good aoe dmg dealer, like earthshaker, so i think i will reduce dmg, and won't make different for dmg of dying creep and dying hero.

ult) Y its pretty strong, his starting int is 16, wich is pretty low, and second skill that help you to recover enough mana will deal to you 250 dmg, also mana cost of ult at lvl 3 is 350, if you want to cast it again in 5 sec, it will cost you extra 200 mana and 350, so 550 mana for second cast and 350 first cast, that 900 mana, pretty high cost??

also he have only 18 str, and gain 1.8 str per level, i think players will more perfer to get some hp at start - means no spam.
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Old 02-07-2012, 06:12 PM   #38
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi] Shadowboxer - Bandit

Quote:
Originally Posted by sirky004 View Post
There's no clear synergy in his skills (I think?). The shield bash is just odd, I don't get why the target and I must be knock back after the duration of the spell. Is it because it offer as an escape mechanism? It only level for the sake of damage. Why not prolonged the stun per level? For me the stun is ok but for the knockback ehhh no.


I have a question about the 2nd skill. Can I deny my allies with that skill?


I like the 3rd skill and the Ulti, but why not have a damage cap for the 3rd skill?

Overall: T-Null
You just didn't understand first skill, target isn't knock back, enemies around him get knocked back, and you are knocked back on your attack range (380)
also it can be used as escape mechans, when you stun your target other get knocked back for 380 and you for 380.... so you are 760 range far from knocked-back units.

and second skill... you can deny your allies but its not up to you, its up to them they need to make 5 attacks in 5 seconds (what isn't problem with extra attack speed) so they take dmg.

3rd skill is old spectre skill.... just it was her ult, and i will reduce dmg more, but won't put damage cap


i hope you understand now...
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Old 02-08-2012, 01:42 PM   #39
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi] Shadowboxer - Bandit

About the ulti, I mean, calculating at higher levels (25) without items the ultimate deals a base 451 damage because of the agility gain.
Without items, Kassan gets 1776 mana at level 25 (1 INT = 13 mana).
So really, he can deal 451*3 = 1353 damage without items at level 25. without wasting all his mana.

Oh what am I talking about, Dragonus deals 1200 damage at level 16 every 20 seconds.
Ah well, you win the balance thing for now. The way I see it now, it's pretty much a good hero, just that IMHO the 2nd skill needs slightly more damage, not really worth giving 200 mana to the oppenent just for 250 damage, easily countered by pipe etc.

Aight, how bout helping me review my creations as well? (Check sig)
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Old 02-08-2012, 06:36 PM   #40
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Default Re: [Scourge/Agi] Shadowboxer - Bandit

Quote:
Originally Posted by deathkidkun View Post
About the ulti, I mean, calculating at higher levels (25) without items the ultimate deals a base 451 damage because of the agility gain.
Without items, Kassan gets 1776 mana at level 25 (1 INT = 13 mana).
So really, he can deal 451*3 = 1353 damage without items at level 25. without wasting all his mana.

Oh what am I talking about, Dragonus deals 1200 damage at level 16 every 20 seconds.
Ah well, you win the balance thing for now. The way I see it now, it's pretty much a good hero, just that IMHO the 2nd skill needs slightly more damage, not really worth giving 200 mana to the oppenent just for 250 damage, easily countered by pipe etc.

Aight, how bout helping me review my creations as well? (Check sig)
yea - btw his starting agility is 23 and 2.4 per level he will have about 80 agility on lvl 25 +20 agility from atribute bonus - so ult deal 500 dmg, and if you cast in 3 times in row it will cost you 1450 mana,
so 1500 dmg for 1450 mana ^^
and you really counted something wrong he have 1157 mana at lvl 25 without any items(counted also atribute points)

and for about second skill i will just put it 250 health points instead of taking 250 damage.
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