Some Questions Regarding Map Knowledge

[Lycan]

How big is the entire map in Range,

(delta) movement/(delta) time = Movementspeed

how is movementspeed coded ?

How Does Sight work, when watching up hill fog is dark, how much difference in height must there be to have a hill fogdisadvantage.
Lets say i have 1200 sightrange downhill i get full obstructed sight, uphill i get none?

How is the shadow of a tree counted? Trees obstruct vision how much does a single tree hide when standing in front of it?

How much is the range between bottem lane sentinel 3th -> 2nd tower and 2nd->1st tower

same for middle and top, and for the according scourge towers.

[BorisPeace-]

Lol too many questions ^^

How Does Sight work, when watching up hill fog is dark, how much difference in height must there be to have a hill fogdisadvantage.
Lets say i have 1200 sightrange downhill i get full obstructed sight, uphill i get none?

How is the shadow of a tree counted? Trees obstruct vision how much does a single tree hide when standing in front of it?

These are hardcoded in wc3. You can't see uphill even if you have 2500 sight range. Trees block more the closer you are to the tree. When you get closer to the tree, the angle which you cannot see becomes bigger.

[Lycan]

Originally Posted by BorisPeace

Lol too many questions ^^


These are hardcoded in wc3. You can't see uphill even if you have 2500 sight range. Trees block more the closer you are to the tree. When you get closer to the tree, the angle which you cannot see becomes bigger.

but how much must the difference in height be to be accounted for as uphill.

[Cáno]

Originally Posted by Lycan

but how much must the difference in height be to be accounted for as uphill.

Elevation level.

Originally Posted by Lycan

how is movementspeed coded ?

What?

Greets
Cáno

[Robzor]

Originally Posted by Lycan

How big is the entire map in Range

The playable dimensions would be 15104x15360.

Originally Posted by Lycan

how is movementspeed coded ?

Movement speed is hardcoded, and is produced as movement in any other map (or game for that matter). The unit plays a walking (or other movement related) animation and is then moved between certain nodes at a set interval (I'd like to know the interval in Warcraft 3, but I'm busy).

Originally Posted by Lycan

How Does Sight work, when watching up hill fog is dark, how much difference in height must there be to have a hill fogdisadvantage.
Lets say i have 1200 sightrange downhill i get full obstructed sight, uphill i get none?

Warcraft 3 works with elevation points, or levels, where each level above your current one will obstruct your sight. When looking up a slope your sight will begin to become obstructed about 100 in range before reaching the elevation level above your current one.

The elevation sight obstruction does not apply to units with movement type flying.

Originally Posted by Lycan

How is the shadow of a tree counted? Trees obstruct vision how much does a single tree hide when standing in front of it?

All doodads obstruct your fog in a circular sector shape where the central angle is 45 degrees. The sectors are located like this;

\  |  /
-    -
/  |  \

You'll obviously have to use some imagination.

Depending on your angle compared to that of the doodad one or two of the sectors on the opposite side will be blocked. A fun fact is that if you locate yourself at a 0 to 90 degree angle close enough to the tree it won't obstruct your vision.

Originally Posted by Lycan

How much is the range between bottem lane sentinel 3th -> 2nd tower and 2nd->1st tower

same for middle and top, and for the according scourge towers.

Can't be arsed with reading the code to find the spawning locations right now, deciphering the Divided We Stand code.

[Cáno]

Originally Posted by e00E

Can't be arsed with reading the code to find the spawning locations right now, deciphering the Divided We Stand code.

Misunderstood.

Just say which towers you mean and I'll give you the distances.

Greets
Cáno

[Lycan]

Originally Posted by Cáno

Misunderstood.

Just say which towers you mean and I'll give you the distances.

Greets
Cáno

Total map: 15104*15360
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
11.
12
13.
14.
15.

This is the basic idea, the distances between the towers is good for estimations. And with those ranges i want to figure out a kind of estimation formula how long it takes to "walk" certain distances. So if movementspeed is 522 how long will it take you to walk 1000k distance, and if movementspeed is 300 how long will it take you to walk 1000k distance. And IIRC if movementspeed was 100 you would be standing still, and if it was lower than 100 you would be turning backwards?

If it's easier to tell the range differences between the tower assuming straight lines around all of them, just tell me them in that way.

[Cáno]

A little clue.
Movement Speed is given in units per second.

Greets
Cáno

[Lycan]

and mapsize is 15k*15k in units as well right ?

[Cáno]

Yes. Not 'as well' though, distance (or range) is given in units. Movement Speed is given in units per second.

[Black Isle]

^continued, And those units are equal ofc. That's what you have asked i think.

[Lycan]

so

in order to walk a distance of 15000 units when i have 300 ms i will take me,

15000/300= 50seconds ?

[Black Isle]

exactly. the reason Cáno told you is that actually. You can measure distances with a clockwatch and a hero with some ms ( 400 would be fine ) or a Courier Crow with Boots for flying ( flying courier got 350 ms +50 = 400 )

[Cáno]

I attempted to get Towers' coordinates and here are the results:

It may be a bit hard to read. :P

Before I calculate the distances I'd like to ask some questions:

• the World Tree (WT) would be on the right side of the second level 4 Protector according to coordinates,
• the coordinates are set in a weird way: In most cases units are created, then their coordinates are saved, the units are destroyed and placed again with previously saved coordinates, why is it done like that?
• what are these huge code blocks on the beggining of the code which are basically parts of (outdated?) main function and are never called?

[ImmolatusBurn]

DotA uses a program to inline many utility spawning and initialization functions into main, for some reason these inlined functions are not removed, even though they are never called.

Well I'm guessing it's a program, I suppose it could be done manually. o_o

[dark.88]

I'll measure the tower distances, old-school way. Take PoTM, with 300 ms. Watch the clock and tell her to run to each tower. The secondsx300=distance between towers.

Example: Sentinel 3 to Sentinel 2 takes 6.5 seconds. Thats 1950 away.

EDIT:
Just got done running around the map counting seconds and 1/2 seconds or 1/4 seconds. I double checked the times by repeating the process a 2nd time. Because I can't measure exactly fractions of seconds the distances may be off +/- 150.

Even though tower distances aren't the same on both sides, creep spawn locations are set at the correct distances to make them meet at the correct spots.

[Valomerkki]

This thread is awesome!

[Black Isle]

Originally Posted by Valomerkki

This thread is awesome!

Originally Posted by Cáno

Thanks for sharing.

Greets
Cáno

"Hardcore Shit" You can use this calculator to measure any distance by entering the coordinates in Cáno's post.

[Lycan]

Thanks a lot Guys

With the numbers and program provided by you guys

i've made this map



It doesn't differ to much for dark.88 his numbers so his way of calcing does make sense but i wanted the precise numbers.

Is it possible to give me the Coordinates of The higher and the Lower Rune spawns as well as the one of the Frozen Throne?

1.(-6496:-4832) T3 Sentinel Top Lane
2.(-6792:-1312) T2 Sentinel Top Lane
3.(-6112:1504) T1 Sentinel Top Lane
4.(-4704:5920) T1 Scourge Top Lane
5.(32:5920) T2 Scourge Top Lane
6.(2976:5792) T3 Scourge Top Lane
7.(-4576:-4832) T3 Sentinel Mid Lane
8.(-3488:-3296) T2 Sentinel Mid Lane
9.(-1504:-1824) T1 Sentinel Mid Lane
10.(1056:-96) T1 Scourge Mid Lane
11.(2528:1824) T2 Scourge Mid Lane
12.(3936:3488) T3 Scourge Mid Lane
13.(-4512:-6752) T3 Sentinel Bot Lane
14.(-544:-6688) T2 Sentinel Bot Lane
15.(4960:-6752) T1 Sentinel Bot Lane
16.(6048:-2080) T1 Scourge Bot Lane
17.(6304:-96) T2 Scourge Bot Lane
18.(6368:2528) T3 Scourge Bot Lane

19.(-5920:5984) T4 Sentinel
20.(-5664:-6240) T4 Sentinel
21.(-5632:-5944) The World Tree
22.(4832:4832) T4 Scourge
23.(5152:4512) T4 Scourge
24.( The Frozen Throne
25.( Lower Rune Spawn
26.( Higher Rune Spawn

[dark.88]

Originally Posted by Lycan

Thanks a lot Guys
With the numbers and program provided by you guys

i've made this map

It doesn't differ to much for dark.88 his numbers so his way of calcing does make sense but i wanted the precise numbers.

Cool, It's nice to see the exact numbers. However, the distance between the towers at the corners of the map aren't realistic. There are trees in the way making the path curve, thus making the distance farther than going directly there, but I'm sure you already knew that.

That's why those numbers on your map and my map are much different, but the rest are almost exact!