[REMAKE] Warlock's Upheaval

[JJE92]

Hi

This is my first remake suggestion on this forum, so i hope you can help me improving it if possible.

Important: Numbers can and will be changed if you post a good suggestion. This suggestion isnt made to buff Warlock, if necessary any other numbers of Warlock can be changed, so pls vote on concept.



Problem:
The main problem of this skill is that nearly noone uses it. Nearly all people I know prefer either Shadow Word + stats or Shadow Word + Fatal Bonds. Imo no hero should have a skill nobody uses, thats why i suggest to change this skill.
Its problem is the channeling, which makes this skill too easily avoidable by a stun or disable on Warlock and makes Warlock pretty much useless during this time, even if he can attack with his Warlock he cant do anything else. Removing the channeling would be lame, it would make a normal slow without anything special out of this skill.
Furthermore, this skill doesnt really synergize with the other skills of Warlock.

Idea:
I personally wanted to keep the slow theme and the concept of the slow getting stronger by some effect.
Once i saw this ability called Injures Leg, which I originally wanted to use at one of my hero suggestion, but then i came to the idea of suggesting it for a remake suggestion of Warlock with some changes. Credits to NoThlnG.



Remake suggestion:
Current Upheaval

Upheaval

Ability Type: Active
Targeting Type: Area
Ability Hotkey: E

Stirs up inert magic in a target area, inflicting enemies with a powerful slowing current that grows more powerful whenever they are damaged. Can slow up to 60%.

Level 1: Slows by 2% whenever affected enemy is damaged
Level 2: Slows by 3% whenever affected enemy is damaged
Level 3: Slows by 4% whenever affected enemy is damaged
Level 4: Slows by 5% whenever affected enemy is damaged

Mana Cost: 100/110/120/130
Cooldown: 20 seconds
Casting Range: 500
Area of Effect: 400
Duration: 5 seconds after being cast


Explanation:
This skill is cast on an area. Every enemy within this area gets this debuff, which does nothing in the beginning. Now, whenever the affected enemy is damaged, hell be slowed by 2/3/4/5% up to 60%. Any damage counts, the dps of Shadow Word, damage through Fatal Bonds or damage dealt by the Infernal as well as damage dealt by your teammates. The slow lasts 5 seconds after this skill is cast to balance it a bit out.



Personal comments:

This would make Upheaval more useful, it can be used as a support skill. It synergizes perfectly with all his other skills and it would probably improve the skill build variety for Warlock. It can be combined with Fatal Bonds for a maximum AoE damage and AoE slow output. It can be used with Shadow Word for a good slow as well.
Shadow Word alone would slow the enemies by 10/15/20/25%.
To reach the maximal slow cap, enemies would have to be damaged 30/20/15/12 times, so the skill is better for supporting in a team-gank, than using it for soloing, though it can help you as well in 1vs1.

[Cp6uja]

Concept is bad. The only bad thing with upheaval is that its channeling. Make it a little weaker, but non-channeling. There, you have the perfect ability.

[Light-Coke]

Upheveal was supposed to synergize with Infernal, as you could start channeling it in the time when Infernal stuns. Or it can be used as a combination with other immobilizing or slowing abilities, such as, but not limited to, Black Hole and Overgrowth, which causes eventually nearly total slow, which the whole enemy team can be affected to.

Very few actually uses it, at least in public games, due to the fact that straight-on damage without complicated strategies is always preferred before anything else.

You should also note that the slow amount is calculating with duration of channel, not with how long enemy was in area of effect. So basically, you could channel it in the middle of a forest, and if some enemy happens to run into it, he'd be slowed instantly by 82%. So tactically placed, you can force enemy to decide whether he gets massively slowed, or runs to your allies (in situation where the enemy is chased).

But eventually, it's all about combinating with slows stuns and disables.



However, this change seems rather efficient. Combinates not only with Infernal and the AoE damage caused by Flaming Fists and Immolation, but also with Fatal Bonds. Seems very synergizing. I'm just worried that Fatal Bonds gets too weak, making people to put only 1 level into it, just to get slow when they combine it with Upheveal.

[fruta]

making it non-channeling will be the best remake

[chadpiety123]

I personally think its viable and very easy to code. But I think 2-3% buff on the numbers in exchange of 5-10% decrease on the max amount can* improve the numbers better. The duration can also be upped a bit (Do you remember how my Exertion** sucked? - let that be a learning experience). I also suggest that the slow be refreshable. I don't think it'll be imbalanced.

In comparison to current upheaval, this one will prove to be 1) easier to use 2) more effective 3) less situational.

Synergy wise, it's great - definitely, no question whatsoever. It works with every aspect of Warlock.

*I should say that what I said regarding the numbers is a response to an initial reaction, it might not be right.
**For more information on Exertion, click the link in my sig. (Yep, it's a shameless advertisement).

I'd say T-up because it's way better than Upheaval, but with regards to this as a skill, I don't know how I'd rate it. I'm not too good with reviews after all.

[AmplifyDamage]

all pro warlocks use upheaval in mid team pushes, to defend your surroundings from oncoming melee gankers that want your squishy ass.

if anyone steps into your slowed aoe, your infernals and teammates beat them up for you. I love upheaval, casting it on enemy raxes while your team pushes ensures you 100% guaranteed raxes are going down, cuz no one will DARE enter your aoe.
It does take a bit of time to wind up this skill, but once you get it pumping, it's one of the most powerful disables, cuz it literally slows you down to a speed of slug effectively reducing your enemy to a... slug..

[Cp6uja]

Originally Posted by AmplifyDamage

all pro warlocks use upheaval in mid team pushes, to defend your surroundings from oncoming melee gankers that want your squishy ass.

Any pro replays to share or link us to it?

[fruta]

Originally Posted by AmplifyDamage

all pro warlocks use upheaval in mid team pushes, to defend your surroundings from oncoming melee gankers that want your squishy ass.

if anyone steps into your slowed aoe, your infernals and teammates beat them up for you. I love this skill but basing your judgement on the fact that you dont know how to use your spell is a bad choice.

stunning you would just break teh "defense"

and I don't agree that ALL pro warlocks play with this skill. I watch replays from gosu (pro-est players), they usually play warlocks without upheaval spell

*facepalm*

[AmplifyDamage]

Originally Posted by juLizen

stunning you would just break teh "defense"

and I don't agree that ALL pro warlocks play with this skill. I watch replays from gosu (pro-est players), they usually play warlocks without upheaval spell

*facepalm*

earlygame its shit, but who cares its a spell designed for PUSHING, which infact is warlock's main role.

Just cuz a pro doesnt get it, means its shit right?

84% slow to THE WHOLE ENEMY TEAM wreaks havoc by their tower. But u wouldn't know from your stats spec.
/facepalm

[fruta]

Originally Posted by AmplifyDamage

earlygame its shit, but who cares its a spell designed for PUSHING, which infact is warlock's main role.

Just cuz a pro doesnt get it, means its shit right?


/facepalm

uhmm warlock main role ISN'T pushing. it's baby sitting, warding & clash dude


sad for you :/

[AmplifyDamage]

Originally Posted by juLizen

uhmm warlock main role ISN'T pushing. it's baby sitting, warding & clash dude


sad for you :/

sad if you think a hero is bound to it's heal and it's baby sitting role even lategame. wow thats pathetic.

Would you rather be autoattacking a carry hero after u summon your infernals? as a baby sitting ward buyer you SHOULD be slowing the enemy with the best aoe slow in the game.

[Cp6uja]

@ juLizen & AmplifyDamage

Continue discussion at Balance if you want. These are suggestions!

[fruta]

Originally Posted by AmplifyDamage

sad if you think u can a hero is bound to it's heal and it's baby sitting role even lategame. wow thats pathetic.

you said late game? carry does the job =)

warlocks function late game is to support (still) and assistance in team fights.
hex, shivas, necro or meka in late game ownz for a support warlock but I wouldn't expect to have 'em all unless it's a carry warlock

-EDIT-
@Cp6uja_
sorry I just saw your post after I did

[AmplifyDamage]

Originally Posted by juLizen

you said late game? carry does the job =)

warlocks function late game is to support (still) and assistance in team fights.
hex, shivas, necro & meka in late game ownz but I wouldn't expect this unless it's a carry warlock

you should be slowing the enemy for the carry.

@ the forum staff

I give a thumbs down to concept of this suggestion.

[JJE92]

Originally Posted by Cp6uja_

Concept is bad.

Mind to explain why?

Originally Posted by Light-Coke

1) You should also note that the slow amount is calculating with duration of channel, not with how long enemy was in area of effect.
2) I'm just worried that Fatal Bonds gets too weak, making people to put only 1 level into it, just to get slow when they combine it with Upheveal.

1) Thx for reminding me about something i forgot to add. I know it, but the problem is that one simple stun or disable can ruin the skill.
2) You got a point here, im going to think about this.

Originally Posted by juLizen

making it non-channeling will be the best remake

Then it will be just a simple and boring slow like some other skills. The synergies wont increase either.

Originally Posted by chadpiety123

I personally think its viable and very easy to code. But I think 2-3% buff on the numbers in exchange of 5-10% decrease on the max amount can* improve the numbers better. The duration can also be upped a bit (Do you remember how my Exertion** sucked? - let that be a learning experience). I also suggest that the slow be refreshable. I don't think it'll be imbalanced.

In comparison to current upheaval, this one will prove to be 1) easier to use 2) more effective 3) less situational.

Synergy wise, it's great - definitely, no question whatsoever. It works with every aspect of Warlock.

*I should say that what I said regarding the numbers is a response to an initial reaction, it might not be right.
**For more information on Exertion, click the link in my sig. (Yep, it's a shameless advertisement).

I'd say T-up because it's way better than Upheaval, but with regards to this as a skill, I don't know how I'd rate it. I'm not too good with reviews after all.

@ numbers:
I might rise the numbers a bit, i just thought that this could be completely imbalanced in a team fight.
Perhaps ill make the duration refreshable, but with a max cap of 10 seconds. The problem is just, that when slowed once, the enemy will be slowed even more, because you can attack him more easily and this could be devastating. Even 5 seconds slow can lead to a certain death.

Originally Posted by AmplifyDamage

all pro warlocks use upheaval in mid team pushes, to defend your surroundings from oncoming melee gankers that want your squishy ass.

if anyone steps into your slowed aoe, your infernals and teammates beat them up for you. I love upheaval, casting it on enemy raxes while your team pushes ensures you 100% guaranteed raxes are going down, cuz no one will DARE enter your aoe.
It does take a bit of time to wind up this skill, but once you get it pumping, it's one of the most powerful disables, cuz it literally slows you down to a speed of slug effectively reducing your enemy to a... slug..

Pls link me some replays of league games where someone succeeded in using Upheaval in a very good way, im not very common with these league games, i nearly never watch them ^^

[AmplifyDamage]

Do you know how many games of dota are played a day?
im not going to link u something u never watch, but i can tell you from personal EXPERIENCE that it's a spell designed on LOCATION.
You think there's a clash up ahead? cast it by their tower while YOUR TEAM PUSHES.

also to the other guy, naming secondary items doesn't justify your arguement since everyone has items... (obviously lock would get a necrobook)

DUH

[JJE92]

Originally Posted by AmplifyDamage

im not going to link u something u never watch

Ill watch it, id like to learn how to use this skill is used in proper games

[AmplifyDamage]

I dont have any league replays of warlock in hand, but that's beside the point, STAY ON TOPIC.

the topic is using the slow effectively, the topic isn't bout "X league's playstyle" etc bullshit.

You want to cast the aoe wherever you think their melee will ever run into your team, aka enemy base.

The best place to cast Upheaval's AoE is definitely by their raxes, they can't do shit to defend their own base because your infernal and your carry, (that you baby sitted) will wreak havoc to ANYONE that stands in a 84% slow.

This is just 1 example of a prime location to slow enemies, you can cast it in mid lane for an ally to run into for safety.

[fruta]

also to the other guy, naming secondary items doesn't justify your arguement since everyone has items... (obviously lock would get a necrobook)

DUHI don't care much though. it's just that your argument is invalid.

first, ALL pro warlocks don't use upheaval (craftsmanship)
second, upheaval isn't a good defense for yourself against melee gankers (wtf?)
third, warlock mainly isn't a pusher
fourth, upheaval is NOT the best slow in the game
fifth, provide a video of an exact use of upheaval in clash and it owns
sixth, after you argue you would just say "stay on topic" to quit from your statement "all pro warlocks use upheaval"?
seventh, I have a username, feel free to call me with it!

[AmplifyDamage]

Originally Posted by juLizen

first, ALL pro warlocks don't use upheaval (craftsmanship)
second, upheaval isn't a good defense for yourself against melee gankers (wtf?)
third, warlock mainly isn't a pusher
fourth, upheaval is NOT the best slow in the game
fifth, provide a video of an exact use of upheaval in clash and it owns
sixth, after you argue you would just say "stay on topic" to quit from your statement "all pro warlocks use upheaval"?
seventh, I have a username, feel free to call me with it!

I do agree i personally get stats mid-game after shadow word and fatal bonds.
But we're talking bout game ending pushes for your TEAM to win.
this includes upheaval in your playstyle lategame.
HOW BOUT U provide a video of a fail warlock.
upheaval is THE BEST SLOW IN THE GAME if you choose to channel it for 10 secs.
It's also AoE inflicting all your enemies.
skipping out on a skill just cuz u suck at it is sad.