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Old 12-23-2009, 03:56 AM   #1
Cerealmaniac
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Default A Centaur Guide



Bradwarden, The Centaur Warchief

Rambo is now a hero in Dota!


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TABLE OF CONTENTS

  • Introduction
  • Pros & Cons
  • Hero Information
  • Skill Build
  • Item Build
  • Basic Strategy
  • Advanced Strategy
  • Using Your Spells
  • Centaur's Role
  • Best Allies & Worst Enemies
  • Epilogue
  • Links & Replays
  • Changelog

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INTRODUCTION


Centaur excells in initiation and ganking. He is similar to Tiny in that he has an AoE stun with a powerful follow-up nuke. The difference is that Centaur's nuke costs 0 mana and damages him as well as the enemy. Centaur is a powerful in-lane ganker from level 2 and is a decent roaming ganker at level 5. As soon as your Blink Dagger is purchased your ganking potential increases and you also gain a secondary role as an initiator. Centaur is great for players who like to gank often and don't mind having crappy physical dps.

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PROS & CONS


Pros
  • High combo damage from 2 spells (rivals that of Tiny).
  • Has enough natural HP that he does not require HP items Early/Mid to stay alive.
  • Good initiation potential with Blink Dagger.
  • Is viable to carry items like Pipe, Radiance, Blink, BoT because of his high Natural HP.
  • Recieved an excellent buff when the mana cost of Double Edge was removed.
  • His spells have rather low cooldowns (15 and 25 seconds).

Cons
  • Lacks a great Mana Pool (not as crippling now that DE has no mana cost).
  • Will get far weaker as the game drags on.
  • Has slow AS and therefore is nearly useless when his spells are on cooldown.
  • His combo is hard to land if you don't have Blink Dagger.

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HERO INFORMATION


Stats

Strength: 23 + 2.6 each level
Agility: 15 + 2 each level
Intelligence: 15 + 1.6 each level
Base HP: 587
Base Mana: 195
Base Damage: 55 57
Base Armor: 3
Base Move Speed: 300
Range: 100 (Melee)
Attack Speed: 1.44

Skills

Hoof Stomp (T)

Slams the ground, stunning and damaging nearby enemy land units.

Level 1 - 100 damage, 1.25 second stun.
Level 2 - 150 damage, 1.75 second stun.
Level 3 - 200 damage, 2.25 second stun.
Level 4 - 250 damage, 2.75 second stun.

Mana Cost: 85/100/115/130 mana.
Cooldown: 15 seconds.

This spell has average damage and average stun in a nice AoE. It is Centaur's only disable and is his initiation power. It doesn't scale well so it should maxed after Double Edge. The true power of this spell is unlocked once you buy Blink Dagger.


Double Edge (D)

The Centaur summons a tremendous amount of inner strength and releases a very powerful attack. It can only be done at melee range, and it damages both the Warchief and the enemy unit.

Level 1 - 175 damage.
Level 2 - 250 damage.
Level 3 - 325 damage.
Level 4 - 400 damage.

Mana Cost: N/A
Cooldown: 25 seconds.

This skill is your key to being dominant in the early game. Double Edge has a decently low cooldown, no mana cost, and OMGIMBA early damage. Abuse the fact that this spell has no cooldown but watch your health, you can no longer suicide with this ability. Nobody except other tanks can take 400 damage without cringing.


Return ()

The Centaur Warchief immediately counters every attack against him with a swift strike.

Level 1 - Returns 12.5 damage.
Level 2 - Returns 25 damage.
Level 3 - Returns 37.5 damage.
Level 4 - Returns 50 damage.

Mana Cost: N/A
Cooldown: N/A

This isn't an awful spell, at level 4 it is comparable to Counter Helix's damage output. The only problem is anyone who is half decent at DotA will completely ignore you in team battles and you really have no way of making them hit you thus Return is essentially useless against heroes. Its good for clearing creep waves though, so if your team lacks any pushing power you can take this over stats (although if your best pushing hero is Centaur you sort of have a problem).


Great Fortitude ()

The Centaur Warchief's mammoth body is capable of absorbing great amounts of punishment.

Level 1 - Adds +12 Strength.
Level 2 - Adds +24 Strength.
Level 3 - Adds +36 Strength.

Mana Cost: N/A
Cooldown: N/A

This is an excellent ability that is the equivalent of 2 free Belts of Giant Strength every 6 levels. This passive ability is the reason why Centaur never needs to buy HP items. Your natural HP Early/Mid will be high enough to tank most harrassment dished out on you.


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SKILL BUILD


Level 1 - Hoof Stomp
Level 2 - Double Edge
Level 3 - Double Edge/Hoof Stomp
Level 4 - Hoof Stomp/Double Edge
Level 5 - Double Edge
Level 6 - Great Fortitude
Level 7 - Double Edge
Level 8 - Hoof Stomp
Level 9 - Hoof Stomp
Level 10 - Stats/Return
Level 11 - Great Fortitude
Level 12 - Stats/Return
Level 13 - Stats/Return
Level 14 - Stats/Return
Level 15 - Stats
Level 16 - Great Fortitude
Level 17 - Stats
Level 18 - Stats
Level 19 - Stats
Level 20 - Stats
Level 21 - Stats
Level 22 - Return/Stats
Level 23 - Return/Stats
Level 24 - Return/Stats
Level 25 - Return/Stats

Justification
Hoof Stomp at level 1 is a no brainer. You need the stun duration to get a few hits in. After that you should max Double Edge First and then Hoof Stomp. The damage from Double Edge combined with the fact that it costs no mana makes it more valuable than higher levels of Hoof Stomp. Great Fortitude should be gotten whenever possible because there is no real reason to forego it. You can either level up stats and save Return for the last 4 levels, or max Return right after Hoof Stomp. I usually end up not taking levels of Return because I hardly ever get harassed physically while playing Centaur. If you are taking a lot of physical harassment (ie. your opponents aren't very skilled) you can go ahead and max Return.


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ITEM BUILD


Starting Items





Starting Gold (603) - 2x Tangoes of Essafation (180) - 4x GG Branch (212) - 2x Clarity Potion (100) = Remaining Gold (14)

Early Game




Boots of Speed (500) + Hood of Defiance (2050) + Magic Wand (484) + Scroll of Town Portal (135) = 3169 Gold (Roughly 57 Creeps)

Mid Game





color=#33CC00]Boots of Speed (500) + Hood of Defiance (2050) + Magic Wand (484) + Kelen's Dagger (2150) + Scroll of Town Portal (135) = 5319 Gold (Roughly 48 More Creeps)[/color]

Late Game




Boots of Travel (2700) + Hood of Defiance (2050) + Magic Wand (484) + Kelen's Dagger (2150) = 12084 Gold

Optional



Easily the best optional item on Centaur, however you need to farm this quickly otherwise it loses effectiveness. If you are going to build this get it before your Blink and HoD and make sure to have it before 20-25 minutes otherwise skip it.



These items are good on you as they give you huge EHP and thus more survivability, however the true reason you carry them is that you almost never get focused in team battles meaning that the aura they emit will be present throughout the whole skirmish. Also, Shiva's gives you something else to do with your mana that you hardly need.



Phase Boots are a possible alternative to Boots of Travel. They give you more burst MS than BoT however they don't have TP built in and they give you a lot of useless damage. These were much better on you when they gave armour.



Great supportive item against AoE enemies. Great for helping with your teams push strategy. A good upgrade for HoD overall.



Eul's is interesting on Centaur, it gives him extra MS to keep up with the burst MS of Phase Boots users. Mana regen to continually cast Hoof Stomp (and Arctic Blast if he gets Shiva's). And lastly a cyclone that is a perfect setup for Hoof Stomp allowing you to initiate without the help of a teamate. Although this item seems really good I only suggest it in non-serious games as Blink Dagger and Pipe are much more important.



Possibility if you have have 2-3 melee heroes on your team and no one else is a viable carrier, this is in no way core or helpful to you it is purely supportive for your team.

Stay Away From



Vanguard isn't useful because competent opponents won't be focusing you, therefore the damage block is wasted. Bracers just delay your Blink Dagger. Your an initiator so most of the time you won't need to worry about getting stunned down in combat. If the enemy is wasting stuns on you it's a good thing; for every stun you soak up your carry has one less stun to worry about.



There is no reason to get Battle Fury or any other damage items besides Radiance on Centaur, you simply don't have the AS to make these items useful.

Justification
Starting items are pretty basic. Grab a couple tangoes (tangoes > salves in my opinion because they can be used to juke) and a couple clarities to help with your poor mana pool early. GG Branches give the best Stats/Gold ratio of any item, you also lose almost nothing for selling them, easily the best starting stats item. If you are taking a lot of early harass you can grab 1 or 2 of your Rings of Regeneration before your Blink/Radiance as these will help in lane.

For early game you can choose to rush one of three core items. Your first option is to rush Hood of Defiance, you should rush HoD if you are laning against heavy nukers (ie. Leshrac, Lina, Zeus) as this will give you a nice defence against their onslaught. Also, HoD is better if you are having trouble farming as the components are cheaper and will allow you to last hit without worrying about harass. The second option is to rush Blink Dagger, you should rush this Dagger if your team is planning to gank a lot early game or if your opponents have missile stuns instead of heavy nukes. Blink Dagger is better if you have a strong lane partner like Rhasta/CM/Viper who can babysit you and who aren't item dependent. Lastly, you can rush Radiance if you are farming exceptionally well in the early game. You can always save Radiance for after your Blink Dagger but if you are farming too much you might end up forfeiting the part of the game that you are most dominant in. Boots are pretty basic, grab these on your first fountain trip. Also, if you are facing spammers (ie. Zeus, BB) you could grab a Magic Stick for the burst regeneration. Definetely grab a magic stick if you are facing either Ezalor or Kunkka as this gives you the warning you need to dodge their nukes. Lastly, try to always carry at least 1 Scroll of TP as it can save your towers and allies.

For mid game you should work on getting your other core item that you didn't rush. With Blink Dagger and Hood of Defiance you should be able to net some early kills and get on your way to your late game items. You can upgrade your Magic Stick to a Magic Wand if you want.

For late game I usually start off by upgrading my Boots of Speed to Boots of Travel as they provide me with the MS to catch most Treads users and an invaluable teleport that can be used to attack or defend.

Optional items include Radiance which you can carry because of your naturally high HP. If you are going to rush Radiance I suggest you grab a few levels of Return later on because you will most likely be focused more. Shiva's Guard and Assault Cuirass are both good items on Centaur; judge the situation you are in and determine which item is better in the current game. Lastly, Phase Boots are an alternative to Boots of travel that provide better burst MS but sacrifice the teleport. Grab these if you are having trouble catching fast enemies or if you are farming slowly. Pipe is good if you are facing AoE threats and is an excellent addition to your team fight presence. Overall, it's an excellent upgrade for your HoD. Vlads is optional if you have multiple Melee heroes on your team and none of them are viable Vlads carriers, this is in no way helpful to you and is purely a supportive item. Eul's is an interesting item to try out on Centaur if you want to have fun or if you don't have many single target stuns on your team and you need to setup your Stomp by yourself.

Stay away from items like PMS, Vanguard, Extra Bracers, BKB. Vanguard turns you into a useless tank, if the enemy is wasting physical attacks on you you should win anyway. Smart opponents will bypass Centaur and attack weaker INT/AGI heroes. You don't need the strength from extra bracers. Usually 1 Gauntlet/Bracer is more than enough. BKB is pointless on Centaur, if the enemy is wasting spells on you you should win anyway. Every spell you soak up with your 47% spell resistance is one less spell your carry has to deal with. Anyone who buys Battlefury on Centaur is missing the point of this hero completely. Centaur is meant to initiate and gank. He isn't meant to deal a lot of physical DPS or cleave creep waves, you simply don't have the AS/Damage to support buying Battlefury. Lastly, you should stay away from Mana Regen items because unlike Tiny you simply don't need the mana. The only viable mana items on Centaur are Magic Wand and Shiva's Guard.


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BASIC STRATEGY


Lane Selection

Centaur is best played in the long lanes (Sentinel Bottom/Scourge Top). These lanes provide you with lots of room to gank the enemy (more distance between enemies and enemy tower). Also, it keeps you safer from ganks as you are closer to your tower. Centaur can also safely lane in the short lanes as he has decent EHP. You are not suited to lane in mid, you don't have adequete lane control to contend against a strong solo middle hero like Tinker or Shadowfiend. Lastly, you should always lane with a partner, preferably with a stun or slow to help you land Stomp. CM is an excellent lane partner as she provides you has a slow and disable so you can easily land Stomp and her aura keeps your mana topped up. Rhasta and Lion are also good choices as they both have multiple disables. You want to lane with a hero that isn't item dependent, this will allow you to farm uncontested; also these heroes are usually babysitters/harassers that can keep you farming longer.

Farming

Your main source of farm in the early game is from creeps. You should be trying to grab lots of last hits because you are trying to rush Radiance, Dagger, or HoD. At level 2 you also can start to get gold from hero kills. During mid game you can start ganking a lot more; you should roam and call ganks on lone hereos. You should have Blink Dagger and be initiating in ganks and team fights, don't hesitate to grab kills with Double Edge but don't save it for this purpose. You aren't item dependant as long as you get your dagger, let your carry grab kills if possible. In late game your income will be split between clearing creep waves and getting the occasional kill in team fights. Your combo damage is no longer as scary as it used to be so you won't be as useful as before.

Creep Pulling

Creep Pulling is using your spawned creeps to help you tank Neutral Creeps. This can be achieved in Sentinel Bottom/Scourge Top (long lanes). Firstly, you should know that creeps spawn every 30 seconds starting at 0. Secondly, Neutral Creeps spawn every minute as long as no corpses, units, or wards are in the spawn area. Use this knowledge to time your creep pulls, generally you will want to pull creeps at about X:15 or X:45 as this will be just before your allied creeps pass directly above/below the pull line. All you need to do is attack the neutral creep camp and move directly up/down towards your allied creeps. When your creeps start attacking the Neutrals simply let them tank the damage while you sit back and grab the last hit. This is a good farming/leveling technique if you are facing a dominant early lane and you are having troubles farming. If you are against experienced enemy players they may either block the pullable camps with wards or gank you when you creep pull so be careful. The Neutral Creep camps that you can pull are shown in the picture below.


Runes

1.Invisibility - allows you to sneak up on enemies and get a perfect stun off.

2.Haste - allows you to easily position your stun but isn't as reliable as Invisibility because the enemy can still see you coming.

3.Illusion - increases your DPS, gives you 2 moving wards, gives you a unit that can be used to block, attack, draw aggro, and confuse enemies; very versatile rune.

4.Regeneration - you aren't really pressed for mana anymore now that Double Edge has no manacost.

5.Double Damage - you have pitiful AS so this really isn't that useful; it's better to save this for an ally.

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ADVANCED STRATEGY


Juking

Your only real juking potential comes from Blink Dagger. Blink Dagger gives you the ability to dodge missile spells like Storm Bolt, Mystic Snake, Hellfire Blast, etc. When the missile is in the air simply blink to a new location and the spell will cancel dealing no damage or secondary effect. This can also be used to dodge spells like Poison Nova, Plasma Field, etc. Simply blink out of the range of the expanding circle before it hits you. Lastly, it can be used to dodge spells like Carrion Swarm, Shockwave, Illuminate, etc. that travel along the ground. Simply blink out of range before it hits you. Blink Dagger cannot be used to dodge instant spells like Reaper's Scythe, Thunderbolt, etc.

Blink Dagger can also be used to escape chases. If your enemy is chasing you simply enter a fogged area to drop aggro for 4 seconds then blink to a safe area. Sometimes this can be rather difficult but it is very successful for escaping from pesky chasers like Balanar and Bloodseeker. When being chased you should try to blink across impassable terrain whenever possible. It is better to blink across a cliff against most chasers than to blink straight ahead. Also, blinking straight in the way you were walking is not always advised, sometimes it's best to blink backwards, sideway, or diagonal to confuse the enemy.

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USING YOUR SPELLS


Hoof Stomp

Hoof Stomp is a good initiation stun, a decent follow up stun, and a good creep killing skill. Using Hoof Stomp as a follow up stun is simple, have an ally cast a slow/stun that is easy to hit then run in and stun the enemy while they are disabled. Hoof Stomp can also be used to quickly clear creep waves. You should wait till 1-2 creeps are at yellow or lower HP so that the spell will guarantee you kills;if you cast then mess up the last hits you have wasted the spell. Lastly, this can be used as an initiation stun when used after Blink Dagger. Simply Blink into a group of heroes and cast Hoof Stomp. Simple spell to use, easy to land with skill.

Double Edge

The main thing to realize about Double Edge is that this you can no longer suicide with this skill; you will be left at 1 HP which makes you extremely vulnerable to enemies. Double Edge is a strong follow up nuke to your stun. It's cast range is really short which is why it usually follows up a successful stun. Double Edge isn't meant to net you kills because you really don't need the cash from kills. In most cases you should use Double Edge whenever the cooldown is up on the biggest living threat in your vicinity; due to it's low cooldown you can usually get it off 2 times during a chase/battle. Remember that even though Centaur is strong with late game items you shouldn't try to steal kills from heroes that have more late game potential than you; most of the time you should use Double Edge to weaken, not kill.

Remember that Double Edge is reduced by Magic Resistance so don't go balls deep on an enemy that has 390 HP. The damage from double edge (assuming that the enemy has base magic resistance) is 131.25/187.5/243.75/300.

Return

The most important thing to know about if you have leveled up Return is how to pull creep aggro. If you run up close to a wave of enemy creeps and use an attack command on an enemy hero the creep will be forced to attack you (if you run away they will chase for a short time before returning to attack units that are higher on their prioirity list). Having creeps attack you is important if you are trying to push up quickly using Return.

The damage output from return is actually pretty decent if the enemy consistently attacks you. Let's compare it to the output from Counter Helix.

Return - (1.00 chance for damage x 50 damage) x 0.75 = 37.5 damage/hit
Counter Helix - (0.17 chance for damage x 175 damage) x 0.75 = 22.3 damage/hit

*I know that Return deals physical damage, I just wanted to use the same reduction factor for the sake of the calculations.

So overall Return has a higher damage output than Counter Helix, not to mention that Return hits enemies no matter how far away they are and also hits towers. In theory this may make Return seem like an excellent skill, the problem is that you have no way of making enemies attack you. Although Return has high damage output it is unlikely that enemies will focus you therefore the damage output is extremely low in practice.

Great Fortitude

Great Fortitude is by far your hardest skill to master. When you reach level 6/11/16 use this combo: 1. Click the Red Cross symbol (if you are new to dota you may have troubles finding this), 2. Scroll over you skills and select the one that's named Great Fortitude, 3. Laugh as you successfully put on two Belts of Giant Strength, 4. Flame the enemy mercilessly until they want to attack you, 5. Soak up 7-10 ults/second with your massive HP. With a little luck and a lot of practice you too can enjoy the ownage that is Great Fortitude.

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CENTAUR'S ROLE


Early Game Role

Centaur is rather dominant in lane, you have a strong follow up stun and a high damage follow up nuke. You have strong ganking potential and should be paired with a strong stun/slow hero (ie. Rhasta, Lion, Rylai). Have your lane ally cast a stun/slow and follow up with a Stomp/Edge combo. You should be able to net some early kills. You should work on grabbing last hits as none of your best lane partners are item dependent (whereas you should be rushing Dagger, HoD, or Radiance).

Mid Game Role

Mid Game is all about your ganking potential. With dagger up you should be able to net quite a few easy kills. Blink in and stun using Hoof Stomp, follow up with a Double Edge and then just Auto Attack, repeat step 2. You should be roaming from lane to lane whenever you see a gank oppurtunity. Most of mid game should be spent ganking and pushing the lane you just ganked. Don't forget to grab a few last hits to farm up your HoD if you didnt rush it. With Boots, Dagger, and HoD you have all the items Centaur needs to excell; you can let other people farm when you have these.

Late Game Role

Late Game your ganking potential is less useful and your initation potential is more important. You should Blink in, stun, and double edge the main enemy threat. If you are carrying Radiance, Shiva's, or AC then your main job in a team fight is to stay alive so that your aura helps your team. "In most cases the battle is won before it begins," take this into acount when you are initiating, the team with the better postioning before the battle starts usually has a better chance of coming out on top.

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BEST ALLIES & WORST ENEMIES


Best Allies

Single Target Stun/Slows


These guys give you the time you need to position and hit Hoof Stomp, also a lot of them aren't item dependent so you can farm freely while laning.



Gives you immunity to your Double Edge damage and heals you if your not immune. Slows enemies so that you can land Hoof Stomp; you have excellent synergy with Omni.

Worst Enemies



He eats away your health really quickly with Spears and Life Break and he usually grabs a Hood of Defiance so he can easily tank your combo. Good luck against this guy.



If you see this ugly bastard crawling towards you your basically fucked. Your only hope is to wait for Rage to be over, Stomp, then Blink.



These guys all deal heavy damage and heal their health while dealing basically nullifying the damage you have done with your spells and eating away your health while ignoring your efforts to attack them back. Gank these guys early when your Double Edge can insta-gib them.

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EPILOGUE


What can I say that hasn't already been said? Probably nothing so I'll just say this. Centaur is awesome, the recent buff to Double Edge has made him an insane ganker that is horrendously powerful early game. He fits in lots of lineups as he is a great initiator and ganker and can soak up damage if he needs to. Have fun trying him out.

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LINKS & REPLAYS


Links

Item and hero pictures as well as hero information from dotastrategy.com and playdota.com.

Replays

Coming soon.

__________________________________________________

CHANGELOG


December 22nd 2009 - Original Post
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Last edited by Cerealmaniac; 12-23-2009 at 04:01 AM.
Old 12-23-2009, 04:06 AM   #2
The Other Guy
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Default Re: A Centaur Guide

This might just be me, but I feel even with the change to Double Edge, a Bottle is going to go a long way in helping you be more effective. Since he is a roamer too to an extent, he also benefits from runes.
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Old 12-23-2009, 04:14 AM   #3
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Default Re: A Centaur Guide

@^
I feel the same way too. Stomping costs quite a bit of centaur's mana pool. But maybe magic stick is better depending on the situation and number of ganks.

Anyway, nice guide
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Old 12-23-2009, 05:45 AM   #4
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Default Re: A Centaur Guide

@cerealmaniac: You should update info in 6.64 since DE has 12 CD now..
I am definetly arguing You at BKB is not a good item on Centa since no single match are free from AOE, disabler ability or items. No need to thank an AOE since its still hurts your teammates, activate BKB when venge stun is flying is so fun..One click of spell you can lost more than 600 HP ( Laguna, Finger or even 2000 HP if you got Reapered) with BKB activated they should attack you, which is take much more times and its maximised your return effectiveness, since return only activated when get attacked. BKB also means 0 damage to You when Centaur DE-ing enemy..
The biggest enemies for Centaur is definetely Rotund'jere the NecrOlyte..
His Heartstopper aura and Ulti is a nightmare to Our beloved Centa..but Hood + BKB can turn this nightmare into a wet dream..
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Old 12-23-2009, 11:02 AM   #5
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Default Re: A Centaur Guide

Quote:
Originally Posted by centaminatOr View Post
@cerealmaniac: You should update info in 6.64 since DE has 12 CD now..
I am definetly arguing You at BKB is not a good item on Centa since no single match are free from AOE, disabler ability or items. No need to thank an AOE since its still hurts your teammates, activate BKB when venge stun is flying is so fun..One click of spell you can lost more than 600 HP ( Laguna, Finger or even 2000 HP if you got Reapered) with BKB activated they should attack you, which is take much more times and its maximised your return effectiveness, since return only activated when get attacked. BKB also means 0 damage to You when Centaur DE-ing enemy..
The biggest enemies for Centaur is definetely Rotund'jere the NecrOlyte..
His Heartstopper aura and Ulti is a nightmare to Our beloved Centa..but Hood + BKB can turn this nightmare into a wet dream..
BKB is a bad item on Centaur. Why? Simply because Centaur is supposed to absorb most, if not all, of the nukes thrown around in battle. He should be a main threat at all times and if he gets BKB the enemy team will just simply spread out and ignore the said Centaur
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Old 12-23-2009, 04:40 PM   #6
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Default Re: A Centaur Guide

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Other Guy View Post
This might just be me, but I feel even with the change to Double Edge, a Bottle is going to go a long way in helping you be more effective. Since he is a roamer too to an extent, he also benefits from runes.
Bottle is okay but you have so many items that you need to build early that I would only suggest getting it during mid-late when the regen isn't as effective... that's the problem. I can't see an item you should skip to get bottle since you only have 1 active spell...

Quote:
Originally Posted by BiriBiri View Post
@^
I feel the same way too. Stomping costs quite a bit of centaur's mana pool. But maybe magic stick is better depending on the situation and number of ganks.

Anyway, nice guide
Clarities are more than enough mana early and you really don't need a tonne of mana anyway. Magic Wand is usually more than enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by centaminatOr View Post
@cerealmaniac: You should update info in 6.64 since DE has 12 CD now..
I am definetly arguing You at BKB is not a good item on Centa since no single match are free from AOE, disabler ability or items. No need to thank an AOE since its still hurts your teammates, activate BKB when venge stun is flying is so fun..One click of spell you can lost more than 600 HP ( Laguna, Finger or even 2000 HP if you got Reapered) with BKB activated they should attack you, which is take much more times and its maximised your return effectiveness, since return only activated when get attacked. BKB also means 0 damage to You when Centaur DE-ing enemy..
The biggest enemies for Centaur is definetely Rotund'jere the NecrOlyte..
His Heartstopper aura and Ulti is a nightmare to Our beloved Centa..but Hood + BKB can turn this nightmare into a wet dream..
I thought I might get 1 comment like this and I explained why BKB is so stupid in my guide under BKB. In a teamfight you have 2 jobs, firstly you need to Blink in and stun/DE the enemy at the right time, secondly you should soak up as much damage as the enemies will throw at you. If the enemy sucks they will probably waste a few spells on you which is GOOD, you want to tank damage because you are a tank and you can handle it. If Necro wastes his spells on you in a team battle you will win the team battle.

Don't get BKB on Centaur it's on par with Blademail for stupid players since only noobs actually hit you until everyone else on your team is dead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by reyrey629 View Post
BKB is a bad item on Centaur. Why? Simply because Centaur is supposed to absorb most, if not all, of the nukes thrown around in battle. He should be a main threat at all times and if he gets BKB the enemy team will just simply spread out and ignore the said Centaur
This is correct.
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Old 06-29-2010, 02:15 PM   #7
Acechiling
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Man. Make some corrections. Radiance isnt optional> its pure luxury. also u havent listed any of mana regen items. Without mana u are useless, cuz u cant make enemies attack u, u cant heavily damage them and thus, u are a giant walking creep. At least 1 mana regen item is needed.
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Old 06-29-2010, 10:37 PM   #8
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Default Re: A Centaur Guide

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Originally Posted by Acechiling View Post
Man. Make some corrections. Radiance isnt optional> its pure luxury. also u havent listed any of mana regen items. Without mana u are useless, cuz u cant make enemies attack u, u cant heavily damage them and thus, u are a giant walking creep. At least 1 mana regen item is needed.
You have 1 spell that requires mana...
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Old 06-29-2010, 10:57 PM   #9
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There are a lot of problems here. Vanguard, imho, is quite useful, as, being an initiator, you WILL be focused on and you need survivability to adequately support your carry. And I don't see a Heart here! But I see Eul's........

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also u havent listed any of mana regen items. Without mana u are useless, cuz u cant make enemies attack u, u cant heavily damage them and thus, u are a giant walking creep. At least 1 mana regen item is needed.
Add Soul Ring as one of your "asap items," just before blink dagger. It's perfect for Centaur, as contrary to your belief, YOU WILL NEED MANA, especially surviving without a Vanguard using Hoof Stomp.
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Old 06-30-2010, 12:55 AM   #10
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Default Re: A Centaur Guide

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There are a lot of problems here. Vanguard, imho, is quite useful, as, being an initiator, you WILL be focused on and you need survivability to adequately support your carry. And I don't see a Heart here! But I see Eul's........

Add Soul Ring as one of your "asap items," just before blink dagger. It's perfect for Centaur, as contrary to your belief, YOU WILL NEED MANA, especially surviving without a Vanguard using Hoof Stomp.
Initiation heroes, like Centaur, Magnus, and Rooftrellen, are usually built in a way that makes up for their shortcoming. Items that increase the small AoI (Area of Influence) that these heroes have are more important than buffing the high HP/Survivability that these heroes naturally possess. Dagger is far more important than Vanguard and so is Radiance, and by the time these items are complete a Pipe or Shiva will be a much better choice.
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Old 06-30-2010, 01:18 AM   #11
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Default Re: A Centaur Guide

you can't dodge mystic snake with blink dagger, however I think you meant magic missle which is dodgable.
Your Phase boots picture looks disgusting pls replace it.
Item build is quite nice however you should add something about quelling blade and early phaseboots it's really impossible to miss lasthits with these and pay off in a fast dagger/hood/radi/whatever.
I'd like to see a indepth comparision between Shiva and AC since I always argue which is better, Shiva is mana overkill but so nice. AC is AS overkill but helps in pushing and helps your carries.
Something I also don't get is euls, your getting dagger so why would you need euls to set up a hoofstomp, additionally you're saying cent doesn't need mana(regen) since he only got one active spell. so why? 20ms? shouldn't really be a problem, neiher with BoT nor with Phase unless chasing a slardar. (which doesn't happen that often and you still have dagger.)
I'd also suggest to increase the time on radiance, sure radiance is less effective the later you get it, however it still is a reason to focus cent, supports will still feel the immolation and are likely to throw their disables at a sparkling centaur, no matter which time.

Don't take this as negative criticism, more like constructive, I like your guide, it doesn't vary much from how I play my cent, but it'd be grat if you think about my points.
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Old 06-30-2010, 09:52 PM   #12
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Default Re: A Centaur Guide

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Originally Posted by VadujE View Post
you can't dodge mystic snake with blink dagger, however I think you meant magic missle which is dodgable.
Your Phase boots picture looks disgusting pls replace it.
Item build is quite nice however you should add something about quelling blade and early phaseboots it's really impossible to miss lasthits with these and pay off in a fast dagger/hood/radi/whatever.
I'd like to see a indepth comparision between Shiva and AC since I always argue which is better, Shiva is mana overkill but so nice. AC is AS overkill but helps in pushing and helps your carries.
Something I also don't get is euls, your getting dagger so why would you need euls to set up a hoofstomp, additionally you're saying cent doesn't need mana(regen) since he only got one active spell. so why? 20ms? shouldn't really be a problem, neiher with BoT nor with Phase unless chasing a slardar. (which doesn't happen that often and you still have dagger.)
I'd also suggest to increase the time on radiance, sure radiance is less effective the later you get it, however it still is a reason to focus cent, supports will still feel the immolation and are likely to throw their disables at a sparkling centaur, no matter which time.

Don't take this as negative criticism, more like constructive, I like your guide, it doesn't vary much from how I play my cent, but it'd be grat if you think about my points.
You can dodge Mystic Snake, as long as it hasn't already bounced to you.

Who cares about the picture?

Quelling Blade really isn't that important on Centaur since he isn't meant to farm a lot. Also, any competent player can last hit without one. And Phase Boots pale in comparison to BoT.

The in-depth comparison is pointless. If you have a physical DPS team get AC, if you have an AoE or pushing team get Shiva... simple as that.

The real benefit of Eul's is the cheap cyclone, you still deal Radiance damage while cycloned and you are invulnerable. You can blink in, stomp, cyclone, the let your allies stun off your initiation, then drop down and DE someone. It also is a great escape when combined with Blink Dagger. You can cyclone then blink away easily.

The criticism that I will look at is talking about when to play with which items. I'll do some work on that soon.
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Old 07-01-2010, 04:20 AM   #13
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Default Re: A Centaur Guide

the return is now changed please correct it..the rest is good.radiance should be gotten after blink dagger as it makes you into a priority target which you are supposed to be(btw i use the same build when playing cent).you can also put a fun build of centaur with armlet( gotten after blink dagger) his high str ensures he can keep it active almost forever.
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