[RMK SKILL] Lina's Fiery Soul

[JJE92]

Hi everyone

Important: Numbers can and will be changed if you post a good suggestion. This suggestion isnt made to buff Lina, if necessary any other numbers of Lina can be changed, so pls vote on concept.


Current Fiery Soul

Problem:
The main problem of this skill is that Lina doesnt really need it. She isnt some sort of AGI-chaser, who would need IAS and MS. Shes a nuker, so her third skill should support this role.
Already said, skill doesnt fit to her role. Second problem is, that it doesnt even fit to her other skills. It has no synergies, except for a forced one.
Last but not least, there are only few players who use this skill, because obviously, the combo of Dragon Slave, Light Strike Arrow and Laguna Blade is much deadlier than anything with Fiery Soul. Why would she waste something on IAS, what needs her to attack enemies often to deal damage, if she could simply nuke them more effectively with her other skills.


Idea:
I personally think, this skill should stay passive. But atleast, it should support her other skills, synergize with them and improve her role, then Ill have no problem with this skill anymore.
Therefore, I had an idea I used as a basis:
Whenever Lina kills an enemy, her MP gets restored.


Remake suggestion 1:

Fiery Soul
(support this icon here)
Ability Type: Passive
Targeting Type: N/A
Ability Hotkey: F

Whenever Lina kills an enemy with her skills, a part of the MC is restored. Whenever she kills an enemy with her normal attack, some MP are restored. Passively reduces the CDs of normal skills by 1.5 and the CD of Ult by 5s.

Level 1: Restores 5% of MC or 10 MP per kill.
Level 2: Restores 10% of MC or 15 MP per kill.
Level 3: Restores 15% of MC or 20 MP per kill.
Level 4: Restores 20% of MC or 25 MP per kill.

Mana Cost: -
Cooldown: -

Explanation:
This greatly enhances her spamming capabilities. The reduction of the CDs helps her in casting her spells more often, as well as the MP restoration by kills. She can use her skills for farming a lot better, Dragon Slave and this could be a new combo for fast farming early-game. When her skill kills five enemies, she restores the complete Mana Cost.
Problem is, that the CD reduction makes it a bit forced, but I hope this wont be a problem.




Remake suggestion 2:

Fiery Soul

Ability Type: Passive
Targeting Type: N/A
Ability Hotkey: F

Whenever Lina kills an enemy with her skills, a part of the MC is restored. Whenever she kills an enemy with her normal attack, some MP are restored. Furthermore, Lina's normal attacks are enhanced with magical fire, which is stronger when her MP is low.

Level 1: Restores 3% of MC or 8 MP per kill. Deals 1% of missing MP as magical bonus damage.
Level 2: Restores 5% of MC or 12 MP per kill. Deals 2% of missing MP as magical bonus damage.
Level 3: Restores 9% of MC or 16 MP per kill. Deals 3% of missing MP as magical bonus damage.
Level 4: Restores 12% of MC or 20 MP per kill. Deals 4% of missing MP as magical bonus damage.

Mana Cost: -
Cooldown: -

Explanation:
This truly grants her damage power, be her MP low or high. When she has enough MP, she can spam her skills, which even restore her MP if she kills enemies. If she has not enough MP, her magical bonus damage is really high, helping her in killing enemies to restore MP, so that she can cast her skills again.
Problem is, that bonus damage has some minor similarities with Obsidian's Arcane Orb, although its the other way round. But its used in a completely different way and concept, so I think that wont be a problem.
Damage cap can be added if it proves to be oped in late-game.





Personal comments:

I personally prefer my second remake, but I want to hear your opinion on both of them. This would give Luna a useful passive, which really helps her. It has synergies with all skills, because her skills are made to kill enemies. Imo it even improves her overall gameplay, she can stay on lane longer, can cast her skills more often. Still, it wont be imbalanced, because she doesnt get IMS anymore and her HP is still very weak.

[Dynes]

Build Malevolence/Hex, spamskill...
Personally, I am fine with it, and with the recent buff, well, no for now.

The thing is, IF seems to want Lina to remain a little hybrid, as in the theme of the base character.

Still, Fiery Soul is way better than the "Ultimate".

EDIT:
Let's discuss this topic on the Visuals section, and you get a t-up...

[-Hominghead]

I totally support RMK suggestion 2, gives her more viability to her role as a Nuker/Ganker.

[JJE92]

Originally Posted by Dynes

Build Malevolence/Hex, spamskill...
Personally, I am fine with it, and with the recent buff, well, no for now.
The thing is, IF seems to want Lina to remain a little hybrid, as in the theme of the base character.

Still, Fiery Soul is way better than the "Ultimate".
EDIT:
Let's discuss this topic on the Visuals section, and you get a t-up...

Well, if IceFrog wants to have her a bit hybrid, he should make 2 skills support her second role, then Id be ok with that. But one skill standing out like this is simply a really bad thing, it makes the skill useless.
Btw, my second suggestion actually remains this hybridity in parts, it improves her normal attack. But my suggestion atleast synergizes and corresponds with her role.

Visuals? You mean the icon? Ive put link next to the icon, there you can support it. The rest is remake, not visual and the icon shouldnt be discussed here.

Originally Posted by -Hominghead

I totally support RMK suggestion 2, gives her more viability to her role as a Nuker/Ganker.

Thx, glad you like it m8.

[Cp6uja]

1st remake looks uncodable to me.

2nd remake is way too complicated for passive.

Overall: Fiery soul at 6.65 got buffed, now I see no need for remake at all. Its fine as it is.

[dominator02]

Fiery soul is now buffed and no need to change.

[JJE92]

Originally Posted by Cp6uja_

1st remake looks uncodable to me.

2nd remake is way too complicated for passive.

Ok, why should it be uncodeable? Could you explain that for someone who has nearly no clue about WC3-Editor?
Ill try to simplify remake suggestion 2.

Originally Posted by Cp6uja_

Overall: Fiery soul at 6.65 got buffed, now I see no need for remake at all. Its fine as it is.

Originally Posted by dominator02

Fiery soul is now buffed and no need to change.

It got buffed, ok, but its still the same useless bullshit skill, Lina cant make any use of. She doesnt need the IAS and MS at all, shes a nuker. No other skill than the third supports a kind of chaser/carry/normal attack dps role.
Buffing an unfitting skill doesnt make it more fitting.

[Dynes]

I like the speed up fiery soul better, at least Lina has some ability to damage structures faster, you don't always have to stick to your "role".

[NoThlnG]

First one is better to me. But I think it's quite strange that 20% mana cost can be smaller than 25 mp....

Also, I think it's better to have less bonus but with nearby enemy died (like last word or flesh heap) since this type of skill is used by necrolyte

[JJE92]

Originally Posted by NoThlnG

First one is better to me. But I think it's quite strange that 20% mana cost can be smaller than 25 mp....

Simple reason. Ultimate definitely is more than 25 MP.
With first skill and second skill you usually kill more than 1 enemy (creeps most often) and if the skills are at level 4, both of them grant more than 25 MP, even if only one enemy is killed.

Originally Posted by NoThlnG

Also, I think it's better to have less bonus but with nearby enemy died (like last word or flesh heap) since this type of skill is used by necrolyte

Well, you have a point. Ill think about it. Expect changes as soon as I have ideas.

[xy4kuz4x]

Version 1
- reduces other skill CD is unnecessary since she has low CD skill.
- mp gains via kill kinda tweak version of sadist.

Version 2
- mp gains via kill kinda tweak of sadist.
- 4% of missing mp is too low, imagine how will she get with 2000 missing mp.

Anyway, recent buff is help much enough imo.

[kings.empire]

As the above stated, too similar to sadist which is a bit of a downer and as for the 2nd suggestion, way to low %.

How about the next spell she casts will deal more damage?

like...

Fiery Soul
Description: Lina gets fired up after casting a spell and the next one she casts will deal more damage than usual.

Level 1: Next spell she casts deals 1.15x more damage
Level 2: Next spell she casts deals 1.25x more damage
Level 3: Next spell she casts deals 1.35x more damage
Level 4: Next spell she casts deals 1.45x more damage

Duration of buff: 5 seconds.

Pretty much she has 5 seconds to cast the next spell with more power before she can't and if she does, the next spell will be powered up as well giving her a combo-whore type usage and with short cds, this might help her late game.

Spell version of overload which is kind of unoriginal though...blah.

Then again, with cds that short, all she needs is a bigger MS boost since AS is really unecessary on her.

[chadpiety123]

Umm, Cp6uja's right. Mana cost can't be put in a variable AFAIK, however, it can be hardcoded to work only on Lina's skills, and there are also other work-arounds that have certain limitations or inaccuracies.

Fiery Soul (1) is good however, playing as Lina, by the time she levels this, seldom will come the time where she really lacks mana. I personally am neutral to this. I think something else (more offensive) will better suit her.

Fiery Soul (2) is good as well, but it counter-synergizes it self if you think about it. I don't know if that's a good design. It might be good though, I can't say for sure.

Null. XD

[gabbeh]

I agree that it needs a remake, but I thought just changing it from a MS+AS boost to another boost... Or just a MS boost.

[xy4kuz4x]

Actually, i don't have a big deal with fiery soul since it doesn't too much different with ultimate (her old skill). But, it doesn't have direct synergy at all. It's kinda warpath. Make it like witchcraft ?

[zackofanime]

I don't see why this skill needs to be remade. It already works perfectly fine since it allows Lina to dish out some physical damage with her strong physical attack after exhausting her skills.

Honestly, it works fine and it's simple. Why fix if it isn't broken? These ideas should be contributed to a whole new hero/skill concept.

[comflocos]

i agree with the ideia of changing it, since i agree that the actual fiery soul does not fits her role, lets put this way, what if you took away witchcraft from banshee and gave her as + ms ? ok she can chase with her ult, but that shouldn't be necessary

in the other hand i also disagree with the passive giving her mana, she is alreay one hell of a nuker if you give her more lane control your making her way too imba, but i do agree with the ideia of making some short of magic bonus to her, as has been stated here.

yes you can make use of the AS in the late game to quickly change up the flow of the lanes but in the late game you can do the same by spamming up skills

maybe you could give some short of multiplier for the 5 sec plus a low mana regen in the same buff just to help her out in the early's

[pavjoe2]

to be honest i am ok with lina's skill the way it is now, and the remakes seem imba to me.

[Entlee]

After you finish cast all her spell, you just wait until the spell cd finish and cast again??

I think it is nice to has as + ms boost on lina since it allow her continue dish out some dmg even her spell is on cd. After all, her role is just to dish out as many dmg as possible before she die or hopefully enemy whole team die 1st

Your 2nd suggestion is good but it just like a tweak of overload(or a weaker version maybe?).

[geo8]

I would prefer Fiery soul to grant aditional damage to Lina`s skills each time she casts a spell ( casting spells one after another will result in superpowerful skills) .