[Rework] Anchor Smash

Redeemed A.I. · 01-03-2010, 09:50 PM

Hi guys,

I'll just say the current anchor smash sucks because it doesn't fit Tidehunter's theme and it should be at least reworked into a more team/farming/tanking orriented passive:

Option #1 is to make

to be cooldown and not random based passive.

Other heroes who have that theme:

->

and even

now has

pros

Stability and Control over your abilities
Farming issues fixed*
Turns Tidehunter into a more considerable tank

cons

No more autoattacking with Tidehunter
Uberlate game nerf
Tide will be banned more often **

*depending on how much Icefrog loves Tidehunter
** that is a joke

Suffice to say I am not good at suggesting numbers but I'll tell you this isn't something to really worry about, because Anchor Smash deals magic damage and it is doesn't work like cleave (it doesn't take into consideration your base/bonus damage).

Option #2 is to make it charge whenever a specific ammount of attacks is made (aka old Storm Spirit).

pros

Stability and Control over your abilities
Farming issues fixed
Turns Tidehunter into a fearsome tank

cons

Still autoattacking use of Tidehunter
Maybe turns overpowered late game with specific items (IAS items)

P.S. Numerical suggestions are welcome

Notes:
-The passive might actually need another add-on to make it more useful like a negative buff placer (slow/armor reduction etc) so share your thoughts!

Happy new year "D
/flames off
/grieffing+trolling off

Changelog:

xy4kuz4x · 01-04-2010, 05:52 AM

It's like Tidebringer of Admiral.

Necro · 01-04-2010, 07:42 AM

Happy New Year

.

Well, as the previous poster with the confusing name said, this would make him a bit too similar to Admiral

. Need something better.

L|Enzo · 01-04-2010, 07:56 AM

Anchor Smash is based on Pulverize, and Tidebringer is as we all know, a Cleave with cooldown..
I guess, let Anchor Smash what it is ^^

Redeemed A.I. · 01-04-2010, 09:15 AM

It's not exactly like tidebringer,because as I said it doesn't amplify the damage based on your attack damage,but it is just based on the numbers of the pulverize...
Well..I didn't have in mind anything better than that,but I find this alone deffinetly a fix to most of Tidehunter's anchor smash problems.Cleaves infest dota in various ways

Thanks for your feedback anyway

Torchic Maniac · 01-04-2010, 01:38 PM

Anchor Smash is going to need another effect if you do that. I mean, it will be nearly a Tidebringer clone if you gets the change (yet Tidebringer will still be much better than this skill still). I really think it probably fine as it is. Despite the fact that those passive that you mentioned have good advantages, we don't need every passive to be like that and Pulverize does it job (even it could be a slightly better).

Redeemed A.I. · 01-04-2010, 02:36 PM

I had in mind that he will need a stable yet not powerful late game passive to farm and push.I think his main problem now is farming,so I gave him something to farm and also be a little more "tankish".200 magic damage should not be underestimated and is actually more powerful than Kunkka on face to face situations.
If you need a secondary effect you can add that afterwards,but I think having a shivas or a refresher 10-15 minutes earlier with a maelstrom like passive is not that bad..well at least it's better from that random 20%

drogirant · 01-04-2010, 03:51 PM

its not just about originality, its also about functionality.Make anchor smash activate in set time intervals, or when a certain hit count is achieved.Example:

every 5 seconds or every 5th hit will activate anchor smash, whichever comes first.When anchor smash activates counters are reset.

Whaddaya think?

Redeemed A.I. · 01-04-2010, 05:03 PM

I gave time interval activation examples,so we'll stick with this for now

Of course it could be an addon to make 5-7 hits re-trigger the passive..But I don't trust it (fair example old Storm)

JohnnyBalboa · 01-04-2010, 06:28 PM

Jakiro's liquid fire => Pushing skill ... scales well because of pushing...
Gondar's Jinada => Chasing skill ... scales well because of slow...
Kunkka's Tidebringer => WTF aoe pure damage...

It's a nice idea to remove the randomness of anchor smash. About the numbers... let's compare to tidebringer. At lvl 7 it already deals near as much damage in much bigger aoe and anchor smash is melle range so...you could add an slow effect or armor reduction.

You could also make another aproach to the "no random"... for every x seconds leviathan don't atack he gains +10% to spin...after spinning the chance is reduced gradually.

Redeemed A.I. · 01-05-2010, 12:25 AM

How about it reduces smashed unit's magical armor by 10-15% so it takes heavier damage from utlimate/gush?This also heavily improves his aspect of a team tank.

I was also thinking...what if the trigger of kraken shell adds another anchor smash for the next attack?2 Anchor smashes is not something to underestimate O_O

xy4kuz4x · 01-05-2010, 06:01 AM

Leave it be alone . . .

Orichalcum · 01-05-2010, 06:17 AM

or perhaps make it active? I mean, you can actually use it whenever you want, at the cost of mana.

And nobody needs to quote me saying it's from HoN. It's just where I took this sugg from.

Unnamed_ · 01-05-2010, 10:02 AM

Still on the quest to remove any random chance in DotA...

Redeemed A.I. · 01-05-2010, 10:31 AM

It's not the random that bothers me,but the random struggle that forces Tidehunter to get IAS in order to perform successful swings when he is not meant to get IAS...at all...
So @xy4kuz4x,I think it shouldn't stay same for the above reasson.
@Orichalcum: Leviathan doesn't have mp to begin with,adding a mana draining passive would ruin him forever.Not to mention it would alter his core and his role...But if you can explain more pros than cons then I'm happy to add this as another option :O
@Unnamed_ : < ... >

jodokast34 · 01-06-2010, 02:24 AM

This is my first official post, but I've been reading the forums for a while and playing for 5-6 years, so please don't discount it.

Anyway, regarding Anchor Smash, I agree that it should be less random, but triggering ~20% of the time seems exactly right. To remove the randomness, all you have to do is adopt drogirant's proposed fix and have Smash trigger on every 5th attack (with some sort of counter building up and then being zeroed by a Smash proc). That's all the fix it needs to make it still proc 20% and yet no longer be random. No more random 5 spins in a row, but on the other hand you wont have the spin-droughts anymore either.

(The idea of making Anchor Smash proc on cd like geminate or Tidebringer just seems terrible.)

Ichigo · 01-06-2010, 03:46 AM

Support (Y)

smilike · 01-06-2010, 04:09 AM

T-down.

What next?! Make VOID, Sladar stun timeable?

Skill is fine like it is.

Ichigo · 01-06-2010, 04:11 AM

T-UP. Promotes last hitting instead of noobs auto attacking all game and rewarding them for it.

infer · 01-06-2010, 04:41 AM

t-up if you change it to be hits based, instead of time based you could get it liek "every 7/6/5/4 hits you will do 75/115/155/200 magical dmg in a 200 aoe and half of it in a 350 aoe" as an example, if you want keep these numbers or change, but the concept of tidebringer/geminate attack/liquid fire/jinada wont work with tide bcuz it would be a lamer tidebringer

01-04-2010, 07:42 AM	#3
Necro Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: India Posts: 1,506	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash Happy New Year . Well, as the previous poster with the confusing name said, this would make him a bit too similar to Admiral . Need something better. __________________ Against stupidity the Gods themselves contend in vain. Puck Aghanim's Effect \| Invoker Victory Animation \| Shapeshift Sound Against the Ropes on www.DotA-Allstars.com.

01-04-2010, 07:56 AM	#4
L\|Enzo Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,040 Blog Entries: 4	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash Anchor Smash is based on Pulverize, and Tidebringer is as we all know, a Cleave with cooldown.. I guess, let Anchor Smash what it is ^^ __________________

01-04-2010, 09:15 AM	#5
Redeemed A.I. Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Greece.Μακεδονία Posts: 7,810	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash It's not exactly like tidebringer,because as I said it doesn't amplify the damage based on your attack damage,but it is just based on the numbers of the pulverize... Well..I didn't have in mind anything better than that,but I find this alone deffinetly a fix to most of Tidehunter's anchor smash problems.Cleaves infest dota in various ways Thanks for your feedback anyway __________________ Rebalance techies' hit attack Wex levels meteor impact delay instead of range.

01-04-2010, 01:38 PM	#6
Torchic Maniac Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Athens, GA Posts: 643 Blog Entries: 3	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash Anchor Smash is going to need another effect if you do that. I mean, it will be nearly a Tidebringer clone if you gets the change (yet Tidebringer will still be much better than this skill still). I really think it probably fine as it is. Despite the fact that those passive that you mentioned have good advantages, we don't need every passive to be like that and Pulverize does it job (even it could be a slightly better). __________________ Suggestion Review Status: CLOSED

01-04-2010, 02:36 PM	#7
Redeemed A.I. Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Greece.Μακεδονία Posts: 7,810	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash I had in mind that he will need a stable yet not powerful late game passive to farm and push.I think his main problem now is farming,so I gave him something to farm and also be a little more "tankish".200 magic damage should not be underestimated and is actually more powerful than Kunkka on face to face situations. If you need a secondary effect you can add that afterwards,but I think having a shivas or a refresher 10-15 minutes earlier with a maelstrom like passive is not that bad..well at least it's better from that random 20% __________________ Rebalance techies' hit attack Wex levels meteor impact delay instead of range.

Last edited by Redeemed A.I.; 01-04-2010 at 02:59 PM.

01-04-2010, 05:52 AM	#2
xy4kuz4x Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: I live in my house Posts: 1,759 Blog Entries: 1	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash It's like Tidebringer of Admiral. __________________

01-04-2010, 03:51 PM	#8
drogirant Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Srbija Posts: 376	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash its not just about originality, its also about functionality.Make anchor smash activate in set time intervals, or when a certain hit count is achieved.Example: every 5 seconds or every 5th hit will activate anchor smash, whichever comes first.When anchor smash activates counters are reset. Whaddaya think?

01-04-2010, 05:03 PM	#9
Redeemed A.I. Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Greece.Μακεδονία Posts: 7,810	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash I gave time interval activation examples,so we'll stick with this for now Of course it could be an addon to make 5-7 hits re-trigger the passive..But I don't trust it (fair example old Storm) __________________ Rebalance techies' hit attack Wex levels meteor impact delay instead of range.

01-04-2010, 06:28 PM	#10
JohnnyBalboa Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 97	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash Jakiro's liquid fire => Pushing skill ... scales well because of pushing... Gondar's Jinada => Chasing skill ... scales well because of slow... Kunkka's Tidebringer => WTF aoe pure damage... It's a nice idea to remove the randomness of anchor smash. About the numbers... let's compare to tidebringer. At lvl 7 it already deals near as much damage in much bigger aoe and anchor smash is melle range so...you could add an slow effect or armor reduction. You could also make another aproach to the "no random"... for every x seconds leviathan don't atack he gains +10% to spin...after spinning the chance is reduced gradually.

01-05-2010, 12:25 AM	#11
Redeemed A.I. Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Greece.Μακεδονία Posts: 7,810	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash How about it reduces smashed unit's magical armor by 10-15% so it takes heavier damage from utlimate/gush?This also heavily improves his aspect of a team tank. I was also thinking...what if the trigger of kraken shell adds another anchor smash for the next attack?2 Anchor smashes is not something to underestimate O_O __________________ Rebalance techies' hit attack Wex levels meteor impact delay instead of range.

01-05-2010, 06:01 AM	#12
xy4kuz4x Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: I live in my house Posts: 1,759 Blog Entries: 1	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash Leave it be alone . . . __________________

01-05-2010, 06:17 AM	#13
Orichalcum Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Brazil Posts: 909	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash or perhaps make it active? I mean, you can actually use it whenever you want, at the cost of mana. And nobody needs to quote me saying it's from HoN. It's just where I took this sugg from. __________________ (I mean it, click and drag it above!)

01-05-2010, 10:02 AM	#14
Unnamed_ Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 5,250	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash Still on the quest to remove any random chance in DotA...

01-05-2010, 10:31 AM	#15
Redeemed A.I. Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Greece.Μακεδονία Posts: 7,810	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash It's not the random that bothers me,but the random struggle that forces Tidehunter to get IAS in order to perform successful swings when he is not meant to get IAS...at all... So @xy4kuz4x,I think it shouldn't stay same for the above reasson. @Orichalcum: Leviathan doesn't have mp to begin with,adding a mana draining passive would ruin him forever.Not to mention it would alter his core and his role...But if you can explain more pros than cons then I'm happy to add this as another option :O @Unnamed_ : < ... > __________________ Rebalance techies' hit attack Wex levels meteor impact delay instead of range.

01-06-2010, 02:24 AM	#16
jodokast34 Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 2	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash This is my first official post, but I've been reading the forums for a while and playing for 5-6 years, so please don't discount it. Anyway, regarding Anchor Smash, I agree that it should be less random, but triggering ~20% of the time seems exactly right. To remove the randomness, all you have to do is adopt drogirant's proposed fix and have Smash trigger on every 5th attack (with some sort of counter building up and then being zeroed by a Smash proc). That's all the fix it needs to make it still proc 20% and yet no longer be random. No more random 5 spins in a row, but on the other hand you wont have the spin-droughts anymore either. (The idea of making Anchor Smash proc on cd like geminate or Tidebringer just seems terrible.)

01-06-2010, 03:46 AM	#17
Ichigo Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 998	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash Support (Y)

01-06-2010, 04:09 AM	#18
smilike Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Riga, Latvia Posts: 77	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash T-down. What next?! Make VOID, Sladar stun timeable? Skill is fine like it is.

01-06-2010, 04:11 AM	#19
Ichigo Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 998	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash T-UP. Promotes last hitting instead of noobs auto attacking all game and rewarding them for it.

01-06-2010, 04:41 AM	#20
infer Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,012	Re: [Rework] Anchor Smash t-up if you change it to be hits based, instead of time based you could get it liek "every 7/6/5/4 hits you will do 75/115/155/200 magical dmg in a 200 aoe and half of it in a 350 aoe" as an example, if you want keep these numbers or change, but the concept of tidebringer/geminate attack/liquid fire/jinada wont work with tide bcuz it would be a lamer tidebringer