[Overhaul] Nevermore

[TraVeIIeR]

Some of you might already know this as it's a repost of my suggestion from DA. This is probably the suggestion in which I invested the most work and one which is especially dear to me and therefore it's here again:

What's this about?

Basically the suggestion is simply to give Nevermore back the original firelord model (tint), and to fit his new outfit make him a fire-themed hero.

Why?

Simple, in my opinion the firelord model is really a great one but the completely black tint destroys every detail it has and looks ugly.
It also has a major problem: when frozen the tint changes back to the natural one which looks totally stupid and makes no sense at all



See how much more detailed the ladder-firelord is? also note the flames on the black one (they can't be tinted), they are still red which looks unnatural
an extensive list of all the benefits this change would have will follow later in this post

The Changes

You can check out the test-map attached to this post, it's pretty self-explanatory but i'll sum all the changes up in text form for everyone who doesn't want or can't test the map

• restore the tint to 255 255 255
• give him the firelord icon
  
• give him back his ladder attack projectile Abilities\Weapons\LordofFlameMissile\LordofFlameMi ssile.mdl
• change his name to Ragnaros and his class to Firelord
• give him back the firelord soundset from ladder
• change his story to:
  

  Ragnaros the Firelord is an incredibly powerful Elemental Lord. Once a servant of the Old Gods, he fought against the Titans for domination over the planet. The victorious Titans banished him and his brethren to the Elemental Plane, but the Scourge released him from his prison hoping he could incinerate the world tree. Capable of pulling spires of magma from the world's core, few are able to withstand his might. Called forth from Blackrock Spire, he melts away the armor of those unfortunate enough to get close to him before using their ashes to fuel his inferno. (97 words)
  credits for the story go to Strapped and wowwiki

• remake his skills as following:

Shadowraze becomes Lava Spire

Gives the Firelord the power to create bursts of lava in front of him at varying distances.

Level 1 - 75 damage
Level 2 - 150 damage
Level 3 - 225 damage
Level 4 - 300 damage

Cooldown: 10 seconds.

the new animation will look like this

Necromastery becomes Burning Rage

The charred remains of his victims fuel the Firelord's fire even further, making him burn hoter. Whenever Ragnaros kills a target he gains 2 bonus damage until his own death releases half of his accumulated power.

Level 1 - 16 damage limit.
Level 2 - 30 damage limit.
Level 3 - 46 damage limit.
Level 4 - 60 damage limit.

Passive

the new effect when he kills a target will look like this

a small flame will appear for a short time above the dieing units head and a tiny fiery projectile flies towards the firelord

Presence of the Dark Lord becomes Searing Heat

The heat Ragnaros emanates is so intense that anyone daring to approach him feels his armor melt away.

Level 1 - 2 armor reduction.
Level 2 - 3 armor reduction.
Level 3 - 4 armor reduction.
Level 4 - 5 armor reduction.

Passive

the new aura effect will look like this

Abilities\Spells\Orc\AncestralSpirit\AncestralSpir itCaster.mdl in a loop

Requiem of Souls becomes Inferno

The Firelord releases a circular blast of fireballs. The detonation deals damage to everything in its wake and makes the ground tremble, thereby crippling nearby units by reducing movement speed and damage, the effect is greater near to the center of the explosion. Number of summoned fireballs is related to the amount of heat he gathered through 'Burning Rage'.

Level 1 - 80 damage for each Fireball, 15% reduction
Level 2 - 120 damage for each Fireball, 20% reduction
Level 3 - 160 damage for each Fireball, 25% reduction

Cooldown: 120/110/100 seconds.

new animation will look like this


and the animation for slowed units will be the paralyzed effect

Note about the icons: The icons I used for the new skills are my personal preference but there are many very good ingame icons available for his skills. Some examples:



Pro

• more detailed model
• no issues upon being frozen
• his new soundset fits better; he doesn't talk nonsense about his nonexistent wings or being a dreadlord any longer
• frees Abilities\Spells\Undead\RegenerationAura\ObsidianR egenAura.mdl which can be put to good use on obsidian destroyer's essence aura
  

Neutral

• depending on which icons we choose: this can either reduce or increase mapsize // reduce the overuse of icons or increase it

Con

• he has been like he is now for ages, and you like the good old times
• we loose the possibly greates hero name in DotA "Nevermore" - but it could be resurrected on a new hero or be honored with a small chance for Firelord to get the name Nevermore once in a while

Final Notes

These changes don't affect his gameplay in any way of course.

Thanks to everyone who gave me valuable feedback on this suggestion at DA and thus helped me improve it.

Phew, that's it thanks for reading. I hope you like it.

[Schremba]

I T-up'ed on DA and I still like it. It totally rocks. I always hated the black tint and the ugly soundset (In' germany it sounds totally shitlike...). I think the names are well-choosed, but I dislike the Ulti-icon... Try out the Inner Fire icon, it shows a flaming ring... Anyway, T-up (and there is also some MSD because current missile is imported

Edit: Some time passed since you posted this and I supported you all the time. But I think I got some nice improvements of the Visual effects. An extra effect for Lava Spire to give a better AoE indicator and a special effect when a unit gets hit by it, another, more instant effect to Burning Rage, a cool looking, fitting ingame Aura model and a changed missile and Buff effect for Inferno. Check it out, I think it looks quite cool.

Last downloads: 68

[doomsheep]

nevermore is the best hero concept in dota, tied with leviathan. t-down.

[MurazorOFAngmar]

T-down I love him for his necro like self and undead qualities.

[Skizzm]

I love your suggestion, it's well thought out. However I find another fire themed hero in DotA would be two too many. Also I'm pretty tired of demonic themed heroes as well.
I like his current flavor much more, and if with new MSI increase someone would get rid of his flames (and change that ugly shade icon that doesn't fit him at all) he'd be perfect. But for now I still prefer the current one, rather then this fiery remake.

[Cp6uja]

Officialy the most T-Uped and Discussed suggestion comes to PD.

[ZΣD]

Originally Posted by doomsheep

nevermore is the best hero concept in dota, tied with leviathan. t-down.

^ Right

Nevertheless thanks for the suggest

[Infrisios]

T-Up, I like it as I did before.
Detailed models ftw, tinting firelord model 0/0/0 is a waste!

[Zirath]

When you tint the Firelord, I can't see the custom skin I tried to apply. T-Up from DA and T-Up here.

[KiReNnA~!]

This will only work better with because of taking ice effect. But this change the theme and the whole concept of Nevermore. I prefer the current Nevermore.

[Light-Coke]

Originally Posted by Skizzm

I love your suggestion, it's well thought out. However I find another fire themed hero in DotA would be two too many. Also I'm pretty tired of demonic themed heroes as well.
I like his current flavor much more, and if with new MSI increase someone would get rid of his flames (and change that ugly shade icon that doesn't fit him at all) he'd be perfect. But for now I still prefer the current one, rather then this fiery remake.

But you do realise that Shadowfiend is pretty much the most demonic hero after Lucifer. Actually skillset wise he's more demonic. If that was your argument against this suggestion. That could've been argument for this actually as well.

We have fire-themed heroes, but less than demon themed. Scourge is full of satanic abilities and units with dark backgrounds and demonic deals. Elemental heroes are at few. Of course there are abilities such as Fire Blast, et cetera, but they are arcane magic and fire and summoning fire is pretty common element of wizardry.

Now this would be a hero built around pure elementary. Do we have these heroes? Crystal Maiden is just a magician, as well as raigorn. We don't really have purely elementary heroes. Fire is just a common theme of spell.

[TiP]

T-UP. The current nevermore just gets annoying after a while. the red flames totally defeat the purpose of an all black tint. Too many fire heroes? There is pretty much the same amount of demonic heroes versus fire-based heroes. A non-caster fire-based hero would be a good mix up of almost all elemental-based heroes being casters.

[Skizzm]

Originally Posted by Light-Coke

But you do realise that Shadowfiend is pretty much the most demonic hero after Lucifer. Actually skillset wise he's more demonic. If that was your argument against this suggestion. That could've been argument for this actually as well.

Actually I would say Pit Lord is the most demonic after Lucifer. As I'm a nerdy Dungeon Master I find Nevermore to be a shadow creature (shade) with strong necromantic magic (actually that's what he is, isn't it?) To me that's not really demonic (I know what his description states, however this is how I percieve Nevermore). And fire based spells are a demonic field, something to do with sadistic infliction of pain. I don't find necromanstery to fit a demon much, it's dark arts yes, but not much to do with sadism, and I would say Nevermore is the only true necromancer in DotA.

As for Fire based theme: Lina, Batrider; and to an extent: Ogre magi and Jakiro are more than enough for me, especially considering how many other heroes have at least one fire based spell...
I know... we don't really have a fire elemental like we have Razor for lightning. But I don't think we need any. Fire elementals are so cliche they bore me to death, almost every fantasy based game/literature has them. I think Nevermore's flavor should not be changed just to add details to his model. I say fix Nevermore's model to better fit the flavor and do what you will with the original fiery based blandness.

[Tain]

T-Down
Firelord is boring. Nevermore as a soul reaver is great.

now with the map size increased to 8MB someone could change it to perma black with green flames and add to map. Now that would be truly awesome

(anyway change to Perma Black is under 1kilobyte change that IceFrog never wanted i don't know why)

[Light-Coke]

Originally Posted by Skizzm

Actually I would say Pit Lord is the most demonic after Lucifer. As I'm a nerdy Dungeon Master I find Nevermore to be a shadow creature (shade) with strong necromantic magic (actually that's what he is, isn't it?) To me that's not really demonic (I know what his description states, however this is how I percieve Nevermore). And fire based spells are a demonic field, something to do with sadistic infliction of pain. I don't find necromanstery to fit a demon much, it's dark arts yes, but not much to do with sadism, and I would say Nevermore is the only true necromancer in DotA.

As for Fire based theme: Lina, Batrider; and to an extent: Ogre magi and Jakiro are more than enough for me, especially considering how many other heroes have at least one fire based spell...
I know... we don't really have a fire elemental like we have Razor for lightning. But I don't think we need any. Fire elementals are so cliche they bore me to death, almost every fantasy based game/literature has them. I think Nevermore's flavor should not be changed just to add details to his model. I say fix Nevermore's model to better fit the flavor and do what you will with the original fiery based blandness.

Well, after all he consumes souls, sucks them inside him and imprisons them, untill he releases them only to kill more. Plus, he is clichely referred as Dark Lord. He is not so straight forward demon from hell who casts fire, but I find him more scary, satanic and black hearted than any Pit Lord can never be.

These demons in DotA are related to fire. Doombringer, Pit Lord. As Hell is imagined as a place filled with fire. However, Shadow Fiend could be descripted as a sadistic murderor who torments souls and as mentioned, imprisons them. That is more hellish than casting fire (Rain of Fire, Schroching Earth) or just plain killing an unit (Doom), because I find torturing and imprisoning my soul more frightening than dying.


Anywho, Lina is just a magician and her concept is so far off from this new Fire Element. She just casts spells, uses magic. Plus she basically has only 2 fire spells. Batrider is a troll who has burning lanterns and who throws oil. And Ogre Magi is yet another magician who has 2 fire spells.

This element isn't really about using spells, but rather about controlling fire and flames and lava, because that's in the end what he is made of and all about. 4/4 themed with fire.

It's not so bad. We already have these demons / shadow heroes an overbursting amount. Scourge is made of them, some are just more and some are less related.

Bane Elemental, Necrolyte, N'aix, Spectre, Krobelus, Akasha.
Shadows, torturing, lost souls, et cetera. I think that is the most overused theme, Shadowfiend just happens to be the most extreme one.

Fire Elemental isn't overused and would be something unique for Scourge amongst these brainless murdering soulles monsters.

These Dark Lords are the most cliches and found everywhere.


Nice to have these ''deeper' conversations every once in a while.

[Skizzm]

Originally Posted by Light-Coke

Bane Elemental, Necrolyte, N'aix, Spectre, Krobelus, Akasha.
Shadows, torturing, lost souls, et cetera. I think that is the most overused theme, Shadowfiend just happens to be the most extreme one.

Fire Elemental isn't overused and would be something unique for Scourge amongst these brainless murdering soulles monsters.

These Dark Lords are the most cliches and found everywhere.
Nice to have these ''deeper' conversations every once in a while.

I do agree that dark-lords are also very overused in every piece of fantasy ever. But just like I'm putting magicians, and fire spitting trolls, and exploding goblins into the same cup of fiery themes... you do the same for demonic/dark themes. (Nothing wrong with that, really).

I really don't depict Nevermore as a dark lord, or a demon. It's hard to explain (especially at this time of day), but each of us perceives things differently. To me Nevermore is mystery shrouded in dark arts. Him and enigma are two of the most enigmatic heroes in DotA for me, and thus most interesting (flavor wise)
Besides I have yet to see a cliche dark lord in dota...

Anyway even if a fire elemental were made, I don't think it would fit scourge very much. Scourge is all about mindless destruction, while fire, though potentially destructive is very neutral as it can be very constructive.

[lorddloss]

T-Down sorry, just like Nevermore the way he is now. but very nice suggestion!

[Light-Coke]

Originally Posted by Skizzm

I do agree that dark-lords are also very overused in every piece of fantasy ever. But just like I'm putting magicians, and fire spitting trolls, and exploding goblins into the same cup of fiery themes... you do the same for demonic/dark themes. (Nothing wrong with that, really).

I really don't depict Nevermore as a dark lord, or a demon. It's hard to explain (especially at this time of day), but each of us perceives things differently. To me Nevermore is mystery shrouded in dark arts. Him and enigma are two of the most enigmatic heroes in DotA for me, and thus most interesting (flavor wise)
Besides I have yet to see a cliche dark lord in dota...

Anyway even if a fire elemental were made, I don't think it would fit scourge very much. Scourge is all about mindless destruction, while fire, though potentially destructive is very neutral as it can be very constructive.

Oooh, I see. Our perspectives clashes. Your idea is more of a mysterious shadowman, while mine is sadistic satanic murderor.
I wouldn't compare him to Enigma, but rather to dark, life consuming, evil, soul-capturing heroes. O.K, my description doesn't match to many really, but you get my point.

Now that's basically the issue.


I think there's the gap why I support this due to the lack of uniqueness as he is currently, and due to the fact that this is imaginational and new to DotA, which is a game lacking elementals.

[Ramodkk]

T-Up This would officially give us a fire elemental hero that so many suggesters (including me) have tried to suggest. Also, looks cool!

The pure detail lost when tinting to black should be enough to implement this IMO

[doomsheep]

there are a lot of fire themed heroes. even huskar is all about firez. yes, we dont have a fire elemental yet but thats a shitty theme anyway.