[Remake] Geminate Attacks (Testmap Added)

[Sgt Failure]

Weaver is crrently one of the mostly underplayed heroes in the game, and the reason is a hardcoded bugging geminate attack. This needs a fix.

Geminate Collapse

Whenever causing damage to an enemy, the Weaver will call upon a copy of the future self to attack the enemy, causing damage. This clone cannot steal health, but can trigger any chance on hit abilites. Damage is physical. Activating Ultimate will reset all counters. Unable to activate against buildings and magic immune units.

Level 1 - Instantly triggers an attack on the enemy, causing 55 Damage. Have 2 Charges.
Level 2 - Instantly triggers an attack on the enemy, causing 70 Damage. Have 3 Charges.
Level 3 - Instantly triggers an attack on the enemy, causing 85 Damage. Have 4 Charges.
Level 4 - Instantly triggers an attack on the enemy, causing 100 Damage. Have 5 Charges.

How this works

Whenever the Nerubian Weaver causes damage an attack will be fired from an illusion like copy at the weavers current position, damaging the enemy, and having a chance to trigger any on hit effects. Will not trigger of damage from radiance, or sukuchi damage on creeps. When all five charges are gone, the ability remains inactive until atleast 1 charge recharges. This ability will not work if the weaver is silenced.
If the Weaver activates ultimate, all cooldowns will finsish directly.

Why is this needed

Weaver is currently a rather boring hero to play, and geminate attack is rather useless when having high attackspeed or chance on hit. This will make him a viable Agility Carry, relying on attackspeed, and causing extreme damage within a few seconds after initiating. The Ulti part can be removed.

Charges works as this: (Imagine level 4 Ability and a Weaver with sukuchi at least level 1 and 1 attack per second. No items or buffs etc.)

If charges have shared cooldowns (Only 1 can recharge at a time)

Time	Charge 1	Charge 2	Charge 3	Charge 4	Charge 5	Events
0	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Initiates with sukuchi
1	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Runs through enemy crepwave, Geminate doesn't trigger
2	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Runs over open terrain, enemy hero tries to flee
3	Triggering	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Catches up with enemy hero, releasing one geminte charge, causing Damage to the enemy hero. 1 Charge goes into cooldown.
4	6 Seconds cooldown	Triggering	Ready	Ready	Ready	Attacks the enemy hero, triggering 1 charge. Sukuchi have 5 seconds on cooldown left.
5	5 Seconds cooldown	Waiting for Charge 1	Triggering	Ready	Ready	Attacks again, triggering another charge. Sukuchi have 4 seconds on cooldown left.
6	4 Seconds cooldown	Waiting for Charge 1	Waiting for Charge 1+2	Ready	Ready	Runs to a better position to enemy. Sukuchi have 3 seconds left of cooldown.
7	3 Seconds cooldown	Waiting for Charge 1	Waiting for Charge 1+2	Triggering	Ready	Attacks again, triggering another charge. Sukuchi have 2 seconds left on cooldown.
8	2 Seconds cooldown	Waiting for Charge 1	Waiting for Charge 1+2	Waiting for Charge 1+2+3	Ready	Moves to catch up with enemy.
9	1 Seconds cooldown	Waiting for Charge 1	Waiting for Charge 1+2	Waiting for Charge 1+2+3	Triggering	Attacks again, triggering charge 5. Enemy begins to flee with low health left,
10	Ready	5 Seconds cooldown	Waiting for Charge 2	Waiting for Charge 2+3	Waiting for Charge 2+3+4	Moves to catch up, charge 2 begins to cooldown. Sukuchi is ready
11	Triggering	4 Second cooldown	Waiting for Charge 2	Waiting for Charge 2+3	Waiting for Charge 2+3+4	Casts sukuchi, running through the enemy, triggering charge 1, who got finished cooldown. Enemy dies. Profit.

If charges have individual cooldowns (All can cooldown at the same time)(Cooldown increased to 8)

Time	Charge 1	Charge 2	Charge 3	Charge 4	Charge 5	Events
0	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Initiates with sukuchi
1	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Runs through enemy crepwave, Geminate doesn't trigger
2	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Runs over open terrain, enemy hero tries to flee
3	Triggering	Ready	Ready	Ready	Ready	Catches up with enemy hero, releasing one geminte charge, causing Damage to the enemy hero. Charge 1 goes into cooldown.
4	7 Seconds cooldown	Triggering	Ready	Ready	Ready	Attacks the enemy hero, triggering Charge 2. Sukuchi have 5 seconds on cooldown left.
5	6 Seconds cooldown	7 Seconds cooldown	Triggering	Ready	Ready	Attacks again, triggering Charge 3. Sukuchi have 4 seconds on cooldown left.
6	5 Seconds cooldown	6 Seconds cooldown	7 Seconds cooldown	Ready	Ready	Runs to a better position to enemy. Sukuchi have 3 seconds left of cooldown.
7	4 Seconds cooldown	5 Seconds cooldown	6 Seconds cooldown	Triggering	Ready	Attacks again, triggering Charge 4. Sukuchi have 2 seconds left on cooldown.
8	3 Seconds cooldown	4 Seconds cooldown	5 Seconds cooldown	7 Seconds cooldown	Ready	Keeps moving towards the enemy
9	2 Seconds cooldown	3 Seconds cooldown	4 Seconds cooldown	6 Seconds cooldown	Triggering	Attacks again, triggering Charge 5. Sukuchi have 1 second left on cooldown
10	1 Second cooldown	2 Seconds cooldown	3 Seconds cooldown	5 Seconds cooldown	7 Seconds Cooldown	Attacks again, but no charge triggers. Enemy runs low on health and sukuchi is ready
11	Triggering	1 Second cooldown	2 Seconds cooldown	5 Seconds cooldown	6 Seconds Cooldown	Casts sukuchi, running through the enemy, triggering Charge 1, who just got finished with cooldown. Enemy dies. Profit.

As you see, the second choice is for following target and having long combats. The first is for burst damage, as you can quickly move on to next target. First is a bit weaker.

Testmap is V 1 and a Charge system is present at the moment.
Please try it and leave a comment!

[kanzakill]

Awesome suggestion. But the Ulti overkill should be removed.
One problem though, does this skill work on tower? Just imagining scares me

[Sgt Failure]

Thanks for the reply. Added that it doesn't work on buildings, and now it also have another effect for ultimate.

[kanzakill]

Huh, the damage type is Pure?
70 x 5 oh my

[Sgt Failure]

Originally Posted by kanzakill

Huh, the damage type is Pure?
70 x 5 oh my

350 Damage with around 30 seconds cooldown

Omni have 360 heal and damage with 16 seconds

I think that Weaver should be rather strong earlygame, and not that ubercarry lategame, but number can always change

[Sgt Failure]

Sorry for the mindless bumpo, but i added testmap v0.1

[Sgt Failure]

Testmap fully working , give this a shot please people!

[killerlot12]

why do you want to change weaver to make him an early game hero? geminate along with his ultimate scales him into late game while shukuchi is used to harass and escape.

[Sgt Failure]

I think that this will rather buff his lategame instead of nerfing it. Imaging this guy (Now ORBS are viable!) with desolator, reducing a fragile nukers armor to 0, and therefore in the matter of second causing 500 bonus pure damage! I think this secures his role as a heavy nuke killer, after all he have silence, an ultimate that negates fast damage and an windwalk. This way, he become a feared assasain, and that blue effect on the creepwave will finally mean fear for all enemies!

[Amoe]

t-upped it in other thread, so t-upping it here

[Leotfatu]

T-downing this to the core of the earth. Weaver is fine as is, she's a fragile hero, but has an obscene escape mechanism. T-down.

[Aotz]

Originally Posted by Leotfatu

T-downing this to the core of the earth. Weaver is fine as is, she's a fragile hero, but has an obscene escape mechanism. T-down.

The Nerubian Weaver counters his own weakness of being extremely fragile

OT: I like the idea of the remake a lot I just think that the numbers are a little bit over the top. T-Up from me for the concept though.

[teStud0]

Used the testmap. Gotta say the concept is great.

However are the copies based on illusions? Bcoz IMO it would be better if the illusions would deal a percentage of NE's own physical damage (like 25% as an example). 5 charges would be a total of 125% bonus damage. Not bad since Shukuchi is spammable anyway. Also it's no longer an orb effect.

[Sgt Failure]

Originally Posted by Aotz

OT: I like the idea of the remake a lot I just think that the numbers are a little bit over the top. T-Up from me for the concept though.

Thanks for the reply and T-up. Idk about numbers, is he supposed to be mid-carry or superlate carry?

Originally Posted by teStud0

Used the testmap. Gotta say the concept is great.

However are the copies based on illusions? Bcoz IMO it would be better if the illusions would deal a percentage of NE's own physical damage (like 25% as an example). 5 charges would be a total of 125% bonus damage. Not bad since Shukuchi is spammable anyway. Also it's no longer an orb effect.

They are not based of illusions, and also here is the same question: Late or Mid. Against carries or caster?

[dominator02]

Cp6uja_'s implemented suggestion Geminate Attack workability of tower will be lose.

null vote on this.

[Torchic Maniac]

I tried to the test map to fully understand the ability.
I must say, I do like it the remake.
As long as he will be able to use orbs, this is a big plus to his power. I can imagine if he will be comparable to Clinkz's burst damage with this remake.

T-up for concept

I do wonder if this will remake his late game more powerful because it is running by a cooldown and more attack speed will make it use the charges faster and using the ultimate to refill those charges is a big fat risk.

[Amoe]

Here it is... my first vid btw (XD)
If the audio doesn't work, or is something that does not fit at all blame WMG.... god i hate those w******

[Sgt Failure]

Thanks

[doel89]

how about making his attack like viper strike

charges it 5 times and shoot!
bullet clings on to victim doing 2.5 or 3 times the damage

kind of goes with the story of germinating

edit: i mostly played NW and what i like about it is its slow missile speed along with germinate attack

what actually happens is with 450 attack range if u manage to shoot 1 bullet at a target and germinates activated when enemy hero is out of range the 2nd bullet will follow it. thus giving it a very nice unexpected kill

[zer11]

Hell this rocks its uber t-up i love this... fits his ulti and succhini (hope its right spelled) harass rocks more.
T-down for % dmg