[INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle.

Lifeburns · 08-30-2009, 10:46 PM

This is my hero from the First Complete the Hero Competition, where my entry was unexpectedly rather sucessful. Special thanks to Gwho, for the throughout review, you was really helpful to all competitors.

Needless to say, look at the concept. I'm aware numbers may need adjustments, but they can (and probably will) be changed later on.

Quote:

CHANGELOG:

_______________________________________

HERO INFORMATION:

SIBYLLA
THE ORACLE

Affiliation:Sentinel
Model: Scout Owl
Theme:Cosmos, destiny, time and space manipulation.
Primary Role:Ganker
Secondary Roles: Spell Supporter.
Attributes and Stat Growth:

Strength: 18 + 1.6
Agility: 15 + 1.4
Intelligence: 28 + 3.2

Starting Stats:

Health: 442
Mana: 317
Damage: 42-49
Armor: 1.6

Attack range: 600
Movement Speed: 285

__________________________________________________

HERO ICON, STORY AND SKILLSET:

Summon the Oracle

Praised by the elves as a being of great wisdom and advising generations of elven kings, the ever-watchful eyes of the Oracle Sibylla beheld the amount of elves asking for guidance diminish, while the number of skirmishes, invasions and wars for more power increased in the same proportion. The Oracle couldn’t stand her visions about Azeroth’s fate and decided to descend into battlefield in the form of an Owl, the symbol of wisdom, to protect the ancients from the dark future she had foreseen herself.

Learns Energy Volley, Ever-watching Eyes, Bounds of Wisdom and Chain Aligment

__________________________________________________

HERO ABILITIES

ENERGY VOLLEY

Description: From the wings of his avatar the Oracle shot a fan of mystical projectiles made of pure energy that deal damage and feed on enemy arcane power. Every time a projectile hit an enemy it will get stronger and travel further distance.
Skill Type: Active
Cooldown: 11 seconds
Mana Cost: 110/120/130/140

Level 1 - 100 damage, 4 projectiles, travel further 100 range and gain 35% damage bonus every enemy hit. Bonus damage stacks 3 times.
Level 2 - 100 damage, 5 projectiles, travel further 150 range and gain 40% damage bonus every enemy hit. Bonus damage stacks max 3 times.
Level 3 - 100 damage, 6 projectiles, travel further 200 range and gain 45% damage bonus every enemy hit. Bonus damage stacks max 3 times.
Level 4 - 100 damage, 7 projectiles, travel further 250 range and gain 50% damage bonus every enemy hit. Bonus damage stacks max 3 times.

Notes:

__________________________________________________

EVER-WATCHING EYES

Description: Sibyla summons the powers of cosmos to bring both past and future punishment over one target. Merging the planes lessens the harm dealt to the target.

Quote:

SUBSKILL:

PAST PUNISHMENT

Description: Using ancient magic, The Oracle makes the target feel all punishment dealt over the past 5 seconds once again.

Level 1 – Target is damaged for 25% of all damage dealt in the last 5 seconds. Decreases target base damage by 5%.
Level 2 – Target is damaged for 30% of all damage dealt in the last 5 seconds. Decreases target base damage by 10%.
Level 3 –Target is damaged for 35% of all damage dealt in the last 5 seconds. Decreases target base damage by 15%.
Level 4 – Target is damaged for 40% of all damage dealt in the last 5 seconds. Decreases target base damage by 20%.

Skill Type: Active.
Mana Cost: 150/175/200/225.
Cooldown: 25.

SUBSKILL:

FEARSOME FATE

Description: Using ancient magic, The Oracle makes the target feel all punishment dealt on the following 5 seconds once again.

Level 1 – Target is damaged again for 25% of all spell damage dealt in the following 5 seconds. Reduces target armor by 2.
Level 2 – Target is damaged again for 30% of all spell damage dealt in the following 5 seconds. Reduces target armor by 3.
Level 3 – Target is damaged again for 35% of all spell damage dealt in the following 5 seconds. Reduces target armor by 4.
Level 4 – Target is damaged again for 40% of all spell damage dealt in the following 5 seconds. Reduces target armor by 5.

Skill Type: Active.
Mana Cost: 150/175/200/225.
Cooldown: 25.

Notes:

__________________________________________________

BOUNDS OF WISDOM

Description: Sibylla bind her mind with all enemy units in an area. Half the mana paid for casting magic will be taxed on these units. Both the Oracle and the targets will have shared vision. The more the Oracle tax on their mana, the more exhausted the enemies will be.
Duration: 4/5/6/7.
Skill Type: Active AoE.
Casting Range:600
AoE: 350
Cooldown: 45
Mana Cost: 80/90/100/110

Level 1 - For every 175 mana spent this way enemy units will be slowed by 10%.
Level 2 - For every 150 mana spent this way enemy units will be slowed by 10%.
Level 3 - For every 125 mana spent this way enemy units will be slowed by 15%.
Level 4 - For every 100 mana spent this way enemy units will be slowed by 20%.

Notes:

__________________________________________________

CHAIN ALIGNMENT

Description: Reflecting the aligment of constelations on the ground, Sibylla create links of cosmic energy to every enemy unit nearby, which link themselves to units near them, repeating the process and building up a chain. The most links it take to bind Sibylla to an unit, the less damage it will receive.
Skill Type: AoE/Toggle on-off.
Cooldown: 0
AoE: 450
Mana Cost: 60/80/100 mana/sec.

Level 1 - 60 damage per second.
Level 2 - 80 damage per second.
Level 3 - 100 damage per second.

Notes:

__________________________________________________

HERO SYNERGIES

Bounds of Wisdom + Energy Volley.
Bounds of Wisdom slow units as you nuke them, thus you can approach to cast Energy Volley at melee range, hitting the enemy with more projectiles.

Bounds of Wisdom + Chain Alignment.
Bounds lessen the heavy manacost of Chain Alignment, which in turn use up as much mana as it can to maximize the slowing power of Bounds.

Fearsome Fate + Bounds of Wisdom + Chain Alignment + Energy Volley + Past Punishment.
Deals heavy single-target damage, while damaging and crippling enemies manapool.

__________________________________________________

CREDITS

gwho · 08-30-2009, 11:44 PM

yo. the ultimate is prety sweet. even, though i'm having trouble understanding it. It fulfills a lot of what was needed :fast mana usage to synergize iwth bounds, additional damage to synergize with eyes, and it's nice that it's creative and refreshing.

is it damage over time/multiple damage instances? i know theres a ocnnection with mana/sec but i can't make it.

Lifeburns · 08-31-2009, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwho

yo. the ultimate is prety sweet. even, though i'm having trouble understanding it. It fulfills a lot of what was needed :fast mana usage to synergize iwth bounds, additional damage to synergize with eyes, and it's nice that it's creative and refreshing.

is it damage over time/multiple damage instances? i know theres a ocnnection with mana/sec but i can't make it.

Damage/sec. I have to admit the tooltip is pretty hard to understand, I have to work that out.
Hope this help everyone to understand:

The ultimate link you to every unti in 450 AoE, and every linked unit repeat the process. Once a unti step on the 450 AoE and gets linked, it has to walk 900 distance away from any linked unit or from Sibylla if the link is broken by any reason (like the unit in between you and the enemy dieing) to snap it.

Edit: Fail at paint. What a shame

gwho · 08-31-2009, 12:08 AM

Chain Alignment:
ok, "repeat the process" helps a lot. i would use that wording.

so iafter it snaps, what happens?

actually, i take back my point about needing extra damage. energy volly has the potential to be a reall ystrong nuke, or a mild nuke. very nice skill.

__________________

energy volley balance:. if it's going to acrue more damage, then the starting damage has to be low.

Accruing damage is a neat idea base idea actually b/c when it's up really close, you can use it as a focus nuke for high damage potential (7x100) but as it gets farther out, the projectiles spread out so you can't do as much damage to one target as you could up close. so strengthening each projectile as it gets more diffuse is quite inteeresting. a dynamic way to approach "equalty" of damage whether you are close or far.

700 nuke is prettty insane. if even 400 at level 1. if damage acrual is going to be kept, i would lower the base damage of hte projectiles.

Or are you going to have it so that even up close, they start off a bit diffuse so u can't land all 4-7 on one target, like we discussed? then a visual would be necessary.

the cone's/fan's angle should probably be specified for 4/5/6/7 proejectiles.
also whether it gets wider or stays the same
__________

The combo involving all the skills: bounds should probably be cast before fearsome fate:
-Fearsome fate's high mana cost can then be counted towards mana depletion through bounds of wisdom.
-Bounds has no damage, and doesn't help fearsome fate at all, but rather use up the 5 seconds when you could have been attacking.

Lifeburns · 08-31-2009, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwho

so iafter it snaps, what happens?

If the unit is within 900 range of Sibylla, the link will extend to her, so she doesn't get punished by the innevitable death of creeps thanks to the steady damage. If it isn't within said range, just a 0.3 ministun on both extremes of every link snapped.

I haven't put great effects for snapping because the links aren't meant to be easy to break. This can serve a long-range DPS skill provided there are units to make the link between Sibylla and the enemy hero. Still, as she deal most damage over a timespam, the ministun prevent people from TP'ing away or slightly help your scape.

gwho · 08-31-2009, 12:26 AM

when does the damage happen? when it snaps?

and if it is toggled off, then all the bounds just disappears, right?

When it is toggled on, does all the linking happen instantly or with some progression?

Lifeburns · 08-31-2009, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwho

when does the damage happen? when it snaps?

and if it is toggled off, then all the bounds just disappears, right?

When it is toggled on, does all the linking happen instantly or with some progression?

The damage happens every second, pretty much like Leshrac Pulse Nova :P
It snaps only when you walk 900 distance of any linked unit, be it a creep or Sibylla (I may lower this distance depending on popular demand).
When toggled on/off, the links will appear/disappear imediately and won't count as snapping (lol at the ministunlock).

Sure, the projectiles will be more spread out, just as we discussed, but I have no idea how much spacing should I put between every one of them (let's just assume you'll hit about 4 at melee range unless it is Centaur with BKB).
The damage acrual is meant to not make it too situational, though it depends on creeps to hit with full force. Only after hitting 4 creeps it will be slightly more powerful than a regular nuke.

Guess I should open a FAQ for this hero.

gwho · 08-31-2009, 12:43 AM

then the damage for the ultimate should probably be written 90/110/130 damage per second.

Lifeburns · 08-31-2009, 12:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwho

then the damage for the ultimate should probably be written 90/110/130 damage per second.

Done

I'll fix the tooltips later, there's a hard test going on tommorow and I need to study

gwho · 08-31-2009, 06:11 AM

i like the percentage idea of eyes.

Fate is a delayed nuke (damage happens 5 seconds after u cast it)
But Past is an instant nuke (damage happens when you cast it). do you think punishment should be tweaked in some way?

__________________________

quick math:
total mana taxable for the duration of bounds:
= (8 sec)*(120 mana/sec) + 2*(210 mana) + 1*(140 mana)
= (960 mana) + (420 mana) + (140 mana)
= 1520 mana.
all divided by half = 760 mana.

the most significant is duratin of bounds and the mana cost of the ultimate.

my favorite is the fact that the ulti has ongoing mana cost, which allows for it to use be used to burn through your mana. this aspect is solid imo.

compare leshrac's ultimate's damage per second, mana cost (rate), and AOE for balance ideas.

Note about concept: we should try to not let it become a duplicate of leshrac's skill at all costs. Rather give it twists, and differentiate differentiate.

brainstorm for ulti: what if it linked damage taken to a unit to all the other linked units? kind of like fatal bonds? really roughly thought out idea. maybe it can be balanced somehow, or an aspect of it can be applied or inspire something else.

__________________________________________________ _

gameplay:
im thinking boots of travel may be core on him to replenish mana at fountain, like tinker. gank, fountain trip, wait for CD, gank repeat.

that being said, once he gets mana regen, he's an unstoppoable ganker / kill assister. all his skills are within 35 cd. usually the ulti is the long CD limiter (lion waits for his, TB waits for his... for the majority of heroes this is true). But in the case of leshrac, mana is the limiter for him. But the thing with leshrac is his other sklils are regular nukes, while fate/past can be used with great optential every team gank. is eyes imba? or no? i really ask that with a complete neutral attiude. I think Eyes is his main skill that is the powerful ganking "thing" - the thing he would wait for the CD of, for ganking again.

pehaps if we made eyes into 40 (?) second cooldown, since they areduplicates of themselves in its basic form, and independent of each other . what if eyes would have the highest cd of all his spells.

hrm... But bounds also needs high cd IF the ulti is toggle: because if bounds CD was short, oracle could just wait for the it, and do some serious mana draining. Of course his mana would go down too. But even if it was plain mana depleting and nothing else, it shouldn't drain super duper fast AND be spammable.

_________________________________________

INSPIRATION: Huskar has a lief depleting/regaining theme. Maybe Oracle's could mirror that in the mana realm as a sub-theme? If she did, he would certainly be an awesome hero. he already has a mana-double edged theme combo, past/future theme combo, and then a 3rd mana regen/degen theme combo. So many awesome concepts/themes in one hero. =]

brainstorm idea: what do u think about a 4th skill that toggles between extra mana regen / and rapid mana degen? When using with bounds, you would toggle it to deplete. Other times, you it would be passive mana regen (at a lesser rate than the depletion speed). It could not even have a secondary effect when mana is in depleting mode. (although it certainly could).

If the damage from Ulti is removed, then a replacement damage source could come from him having above average attacking power.

But then again, not having any bonus regen could be the balancing factor, just like leshrac... do you have any ideas that might be like huskar/s HP regen/degen counterpart for mana?

completely separating from my ulti tweak suggestion, what do you think about the mana regen/degen sub-theme? concept?

________________________________

btw the icons are so good.

i know i suggested a whole lot of things at once. try not to get overwhelmed or associate one idea with another. u can separate the ideas u like and the ones you don't like

chadpiety123 · 08-31-2009, 06:51 AM

Nice suggestion in my opinion.

But before any review, I'd say that there's no damage detection system in DotA, so you can't know if the damage type is spell, magical, etc. I suggest you just make Ever Seeing Eyes detect all damages as a whole (general).

I really like Ever Seeing Eyes and Chain Alignment a lot, although I can't understand it (Ultimate) very much (pretty weird e?). Hope you could clear Ultimate's tooltip more.

I'll review after the clarifications.

gwho · 08-31-2009, 07:09 AM

as far as i understand, the ulti is a lot like leshrac's ulti - the AOE is just complicated. (chain distance of 450)

hey, is this a hero-only pulse nova?

i kind of find myself wanting to bring out the cool star-chain aspect out more.

_____________

damage type detection? i think that isn't necessary because weaver will attest to the fact that HP x seconds ago is detectable. The code for eyes can simply take the differnece of the HP x seconds ago andthe current HP, then apply a multiplier to formulate the final spell damage.

gwho · 08-31-2009, 08:05 AM

edit: oops double post. sorry. i had no intention of bumping. i used the quote button and it did this. i forgot to clikc quote, copy, and then edit my latest post.

current combo should be be changed to...

this.

Quote:

The combo involving all the skills: bounds should probably be cast before fearsome fate:
-Fearsome fate's high mana cost can then be counted towards mana depletion through bounds of wisdom.
-Bounds has no damage, and doesn't help fearsome fate at all, but rather use up the 5 seconds when you could have been attacking.

Alternate use of this combo: cast bounds on one hero, but cast the rest on another
you can cast bounds on an enemy hero with high mana to pucharge them with the mana-bill on them while doing the rest of the combo on a low-mana hero that you want to actually focus-fire. In this way, you can use your main combo on the hero you want, even if he doesnt have a high mana pool, and the bounded hero becomes less of a threat b/c of the mana tax.

If the "bounded" intel hero chooses to run away, he will end up losing mana, but he is also slowed, allowing you and your team to follow up and catch up to him more easily, and kill him. Using bounds on a hero other than the one you are focus-firing is kind of like marinating your next target.

If the "bounded" intel hero stays, he will run out of mana very quickly, becoming easier to kill or flee from after you kill the first focus-fired guy.

we should get zirath to create this hero in a testmap

Dejaime · 08-31-2009, 11:30 AM

I like the ulti, nice, but the twin skills looks kida too strong...
Anyway, considering the possibility of a balancing (or not, haven't made any calcs), you got a tup.

Zirath · 08-31-2009, 12:31 PM

Wow, nice new ulti. This all comes together perfectly. Though the ult is very hefty on mana and also very similar to Pulse Nova. I get that the chains only effect units in the range; if two units are linked both with Bounds of Wisdom and Chain Alignment, do they take damage from both links (So 90 + 90*Reduction)?

Also, the ult should really be called Cosmic Chains or Astral Chains because it has to do with the stars not with Alignments.

gwho · 08-31-2009, 05:10 PM

hey lifeburns, can you use diffeent tags instead of quote tags, so we in turn can quote it with the formatting?

btw nice hotkey assinign. it ends up as w e r t g. so good

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zirath

Wow, nice new ulti. This all comes together perfectly. Though the ult is very hefty on mana and also very similar to Pulse Nova. I get that the chains only effect units in the range; if two units are linked both with Bounds of Wisdom and Chain Alignment, do they take damage from both links (So 90 + 90*Reduction)?

Also, the ult should really be called Cosmic Chains or Astral Chains because it has to do with the stars not with Alignments.

I think an idea like that (less damage for secondary and tertiary etc linked units) could bring about balance for the huge AOE of the skill right now.

rightnow, everything about the skill is stronger than leshrac's pulse nova. needs nerfing.

BALANCE:
If Oracle uses bounds, and then star alignment, then the initial cost can be considered to be the mana cost of bounds, and then the ulti's mana cost will become 60/sec, exacly the smae as leshrac.
-So if the damage is reduced similar to leshrac's, then the balance would be awesine, - the damage output is comaprable to leshrac.
-Without bounds, it costs twice as much as leshrac's spell, justifying the large AOE.
-diminished damage for links not directly from oracle helps the balance too.
-As will having it be hero only, if that's an idea you like. (energy volley is alraedy a nice farming skill on creeps)

name: stars aligning has to do with "fate" like in astrology. keep in mind the 3rd skill is called "bounds of wisdom" so another skill shoulnd't have too similar of a name to it.

fate can be balanced with percentages from 40-70 lowered.

i just noticed the secondary (but different) effects of fate and past - DAS and Decreased attack. now it really has some versatility! im liking it a lot. since the skill has two aspects, and each are doubled, lowering numbers are is needed.

Lifeburns · 08-31-2009, 09:48 PM

Just number issues with this hero? No criticism other than the tooltips? I'm surprised, dunno if this is good or bad

Quote:

Originally Posted by chadpiety123

Nice suggestion in my opinion.

But before any review, I'd say that there's no damage detection system in DotA, so you can't know if the damage type is spell, magical, etc. I suggest you just make Ever Seeing Eyes detect all damages as a whole (general).

I really like Ever Seeing Eyes and Chain Alignment a lot, although I can't understand it (Ultimate) very much (pretty weird e?). Hope you could clear Ultimate's tooltip more.

I'll review after the clarifications.

Are you sure?

Then I'll reduce it by a lot, and maybe change the other effects.

@ Gwho:
Whoa, you got a big brainstorming there! I've planned the ult to deal big damage to make the most of eyes, either by single targeted burst damage or heavy AoE damage. The former would make it too similar to Finger or Laguna Blade, and would need a huge manacost to synergize with Bounds, so it wouldn't be available enough times to gank untill late-mid game. The way to go was a DPS skill. The chain effect and damage reduction are to differentiate it from the boring "deal damage around AoE" and favor strategic positioning over rambooing in a clash.
The manacost is a double-edge issue, if I make it too high, it will drain too much mana on enemies, but if I make it too low Bounds will be innefective. I'm split between making it a medium manacost with constant drain (thus draining the same mana no matter how many heroes were caught in Bounds) or keping it the way it is. This doesn't mean numbers are final though.

If you have any idea of a constant damage skill other than DoT, feel free to share it with us.

Edit: Fixed the tooltip, made some balance changes and added images so you can see the "links" of the chain, and hopefully clear out any doubts about the ultimate.

gwho · 09-01-2009, 01:42 AM

ulti:
the chain is broken by bein 900 units away from the unit you are connected to or 900 units away from sibylla?

i have an idea to make it the ulti interesting. the linking "chains" to other surroudning units and so on and so on, right? so lets say sibylla links one enemy and he chains to link the 2nd enemy .... 3rd enemy ...... 4th enemy. Simple, nothing different yet. however, if 2nd, 3rd, 4th are wihtin a 450 distance triaingle, there could be a direct link between 2nd enmy and 4th enemy. so right now, 2nd enemy has 3 links: sybilla, 3rd, and 4th. and it could get complicated: 4th enemy could be directly linked to sybillla, and a 5th, and 6th. etc

So the idea is this: those that have a certain number of links receive a higher DOT value, whereas the enemies with less than a certain number of links take lesser DOT.
the DOT value.
numbers could go like this (rough idea):

Quote:

lvl1 20 damage/s, star-crossed DOT = 40 damage/s, 7 links to become star-crossed
lvl2 30 damage/s, star-crossed DOT = 50 damage/s, 6 links to become star-crossed
lvl3 40 damage/s, star-crossed DOT = 70 damage/s, 5 links to become star-crossed

all individual links could be broken at any time if fulfilling conditions of breaking.

The effect could be something else beesides higher DOT, but the x number of links leading to a secondary effect is the main concept. here, i call fulfilling that number of links being "star-crossed" (no, it doesnt mean you fall in love, it means your fate is bad)

gameplay:
the DOT is nerfed, but can be stronger than pulse nova. Thus it makes you want to time and position yourself hwen you use this.

it would synergize with stuns, vacuuming moves, as well as bounds, since bounds of wisdom slows from zero to stronger as time passes. as you use up your mana with the ulti.

Zirath · 09-01-2009, 01:54 AM

Now it sounds like Quill Spray >_>.

james_king · 09-01-2009, 02:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zirath

Now it sounds like Quill Spray >_>.

i agreeeeeeeee

08-30-2009, 11:44 PM	#2
gwho Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,211 Blog Entries: 1	Re: [INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle. yo. the ultimate is prety sweet. even, though i'm having trouble understanding it. It fulfills a lot of what was needed :fast mana usage to synergize iwth bounds, additional damage to synergize with eyes, and it's nice that it's creative and refreshing. is it damage over time/multiple damage instances? i know theres a ocnnection with mana/sec but i can't make it. __________________ Viper Guide Murloc Hero! The Oracle-Sibylla

Last edited by gwho; 08-30-2009 at 11:49 PM.

08-31-2009, 12:08 AM	#4
gwho Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,211 Blog Entries: 1	Re: [INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle. Chain Alignment: ok, "repeat the process" helps a lot. i would use that wording. so iafter it snaps, what happens? actually, i take back my point about needing extra damage. energy volly has the potential to be a reall ystrong nuke, or a mild nuke. very nice skill. __________________ energy volley balance:. if it's going to acrue more damage, then the starting damage has to be low. Accruing damage is a neat idea base idea actually b/c when it's up really close, you can use it as a focus nuke for high damage potential (7x100) but as it gets farther out, the projectiles spread out so you can't do as much damage to one target as you could up close. so strengthening each projectile as it gets more diffuse is quite inteeresting. a dynamic way to approach "equalty" of damage whether you are close or far. 700 nuke is prettty insane. if even 400 at level 1. if damage acrual is going to be kept, i would lower the base damage of hte projectiles. Or are you going to have it so that even up close, they start off a bit diffuse so u can't land all 4-7 on one target, like we discussed? then a visual would be necessary. the cone's/fan's angle should probably be specified for 4/5/6/7 proejectiles. also whether it gets wider or stays the same __________ The combo involving all the skills: bounds should probably be cast before fearsome fate: -Fearsome fate's high mana cost can then be counted towards mana depletion through bounds of wisdom. -Bounds has no damage, and doesn't help fearsome fate at all, but rather use up the 5 seconds when you could have been attacking. __________________ Viper Guide Murloc Hero! The Oracle-Sibylla

Last edited by gwho; 08-31-2009 at 12:28 AM.

08-31-2009, 12:26 AM	#6
gwho Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,211 Blog Entries: 1	Re: [INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle. when does the damage happen? when it snaps? and if it is toggled off, then all the bounds just disappears, right? When it is toggled on, does all the linking happen instantly or with some progression? __________________ Viper Guide Murloc Hero! The Oracle-Sibylla

08-31-2009, 12:43 AM	#8
gwho Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,211 Blog Entries: 1	Re: [INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle. then the damage for the ultimate should probably be written 90/110/130 damage per second. __________________ Viper Guide Murloc Hero! The Oracle-Sibylla

08-31-2009, 06:11 AM	#10
gwho Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,211 Blog Entries: 1	Re: [INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle. i like the percentage idea of eyes. Fate is a delayed nuke (damage happens 5 seconds after u cast it) But Past is an instant nuke (damage happens when you cast it). do you think punishment should be tweaked in some way? __________________________ quick math: total mana taxable for the duration of bounds: = (8 sec)(120 mana/sec) + 2(210 mana) + 1(140 mana) = (960 mana) + (420 mana) + (140 mana) = 1520 mana. all divided by half = 760 mana. the most significant is duratin of bounds and the mana cost of the ultimate. my favorite is the fact that the ulti has ongoing mana cost, which allows for it to use be used to burn through your mana. this aspect is solid imo. compare leshrac's ultimate's damage per second, mana cost (rate), and AOE for balance ideas. Note about concept: we should try to not let it become a duplicate of leshrac's skill at all costs. Rather give it twists, and differentiate differentiate. brainstorm for ulti: what if it linked damage taken to a unit to all the other linked units? kind of like fatal bonds? really roughly thought out idea. maybe it can be balanced somehow, or an aspect of it can be applied or inspire something else. __________________________________________________ _ gameplay:* im thinking boots of travel may be core on him to replenish mana at fountain, like tinker. gank, fountain trip, wait for CD, gank repeat. that being said, once he gets mana regen, he's an unstoppoable ganker / kill assister. all his skills are within 35 cd. usually the ulti is the long CD limiter (lion waits for his, TB waits for his... for the majority of heroes this is true). But in the case of leshrac, mana is the limiter for him. But the thing with leshrac is his other sklils are regular nukes, while fate/past can be used with great optential every team gank. is eyes imba? or no? i really ask that with a complete neutral attiude. I think Eyes is his main skill that is the powerful ganking "thing" - the thing he would wait for the CD of, for ganking again. pehaps if we made eyes into 40 (?) second cooldown, since they areduplicates of themselves in its basic form, and independent of each other . what if eyes would have the highest cd of all his spells. hrm... But bounds also needs high cd IF the ulti is toggle: because if bounds CD was short, oracle could just wait for the it, and do some serious mana draining. Of course his mana would go down too. But even if it was plain mana depleting and nothing else, it shouldn't drain super duper fast AND be spammable. _________________________________________ INSPIRATION: Huskar has a lief depleting/regaining theme. Maybe Oracle's could mirror that in the mana realm as a sub-theme? If she did, he would certainly be an awesome hero. he already has a mana-double edged theme combo, past/future theme combo, and then a 3rd mana regen/degen theme combo. So many awesome concepts/themes in one hero. =] brainstorm idea: what do u think about a 4th skill that toggles between extra mana regen / and rapid mana degen? When using with bounds, you would toggle it to deplete. Other times, you it would be passive mana regen (at a lesser rate than the depletion speed). It could not even have a secondary effect when mana is in depleting mode. (although it certainly could). If the damage from Ulti is removed, then a replacement damage source could come from him having above average attacking power. But then again, not having any bonus regen could be the balancing factor, just like leshrac... do you have any ideas that might be like huskar/s HP regen/degen counterpart for mana? completely separating from my ulti tweak suggestion, what do you think about the mana regen/degen sub-theme? concept? ________________________________ btw the icons are so good. i know i suggested a whole lot of things at once. try not to get overwhelmed or associate one idea with another. u can separate the ideas u like and the ones you don't like __________________ Viper Guide Murloc Hero! The Oracle-Sibylla

Last edited by gwho; 08-31-2009 at 07:05 AM.

08-31-2009, 06:51 AM	#11
chadpiety123 Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 2,662	Re: [INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle. Nice suggestion in my opinion. But before any review, I'd say that there's no damage detection system in DotA, so you can't know if the damage type is spell, magical, etc. I suggest you just make Ever Seeing Eyes detect all damages as a whole (general). I really like Ever Seeing Eyes and Chain Alignment a lot, although I can't understand it (Ultimate) very much (pretty weird e?). Hope you could clear Ultimate's tooltip more. I'll review after the clarifications. __________________ Hi, I'm new here. Hope people could help me out start a new suggestion!

08-31-2009, 07:09 AM	#12
gwho Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,211 Blog Entries: 1	Re: [INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle. as far as i understand, the ulti is a lot like leshrac's ulti - the AOE is just complicated. (chain distance of 450) hey, is this a hero-only pulse nova? i kind of find myself wanting to bring out the cool star-chain aspect out more. _____________ damage type detection? i think that isn't necessary because weaver will attest to the fact that HP x seconds ago is detectable. The code for eyes can simply take the differnece of the HP x seconds ago andthe current HP, then apply a multiplier to formulate the final spell damage. __________________ Viper Guide Murloc Hero! The Oracle-Sibylla

Last edited by gwho; 08-31-2009 at 05:17 PM.

08-31-2009, 11:30 AM	#14
Dejaime Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Bot Posts: 1,310 Blog Entries: 2	Re: [INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle. I like the ulti, nice, but the twin skills looks kida too strong... Anyway, considering the possibility of a balancing (or not, haven't made any calcs), you got a tup. __________________ Don't have access to DotA2 yet? PM me for an invite. Fix Storm's Ultimate Targeting System. It works in DotA2, why doesn't it in Warcraft? The newbies' guide to Raijin, The Storm Spirit

08-31-2009, 12:31 PM	#15
Zirath Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Wherever Posts: 1,836	Re: [INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle. Wow, nice new ulti. This all comes together perfectly. Though the ult is very hefty on mana and also very similar to Pulse Nova. I get that the chains only effect units in the range; if two units are linked both with Bounds of Wisdom and Chain Alignment, do they take damage from both links (So 90 + 90*Reduction)? Also, the ult should really be called Cosmic Chains or Astral Chains because it has to do with the stars not with Alignments. __________________ While I have partially returned to the forums, I am still not making test maps. If you have a small request, you can PM and I will try to work something out, but I do not have the time to make full test maps.

09-01-2009, 01:54 AM	#19
Zirath Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Wherever Posts: 1,836	Re: [INT - SENT] Sibylla, The Oracle. Now it sounds like Quill Spray >_>. __________________ While I have partially returned to the forums, I am still not making test maps. If you have a small request, you can PM and I will try to work something out, but I do not have the time to make full test maps.