Developer's Blog
Register Low Fi Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 08-01-2010, 12:44 PM   #1
Cheaterhater
Member
 
Cheaterhater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: GetUnitLoc(udg_Cheaterhater)
Posts: 1,630
Blog Entries: 3
Cheaterhater is offline

Default [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole


I think most of you know that Black Hole used not only to silence skills, but also items. However, a few versions ago, this stopped to work so IceFrog had to implement a fix, which just turns the caught units a bit around, so they can't target their spells in most cases. However, instant spells like Shiva's Guard will still work.
But I think the intention is to prevent using items at all, so I suggest a simple fix:
Change the AInv (hero inventory) ability to have two levels. The first level works as usual, the hero can have six items, they can be picked up, dropped, and used. As all heroes will start with this ability at level 1, this won't affect the game and won't require any further coding to work.
The second level of the ability still allows the hero to carry six items, but he can neither use, nor drop, nor pick them up. When a hero is affected by Black Hole, the inventory ability changes its level and the hero can't use active inventory items anymore. If Black Hole ends or he gets out of it somehow, the inventory ability is set to level 1 and works as usual.

I ran a few tests with this and it seems to work for me. However, it is a bit "bugged" (don't be upset and read on... it's this "bug" which makes this method to work as it should!), as changing the level of the inventory ability still allows you to use passive item abilites, whereas having such an ability from the beginning wouldn't allow you to use ANY of the item's abilites at all, so you could assume it would also disable passives. But this is not the case; when the ability allows using items and is changed later on not to allow using items, this "bug" occurs and ONLY active abilites of items will be disabled, passive item abilites will still work. I think this (disabling active item abilities, not passives) is intended for Black Hole anyway.

So, TL;DR: Fix Black Hole to disable active item abilities properly with the method I described.

Pros:
- Black Hole would work as it should by disabling active item abilites properly

Cons:
- It would affect balance as it would be a slight buff to Enigma

I can create a testmap if necessary. If there is any downside in the mechanics I didn't think of, please let me know.
__________________
  Reply With Quote
Last edited by Cheaterhater; 08-02-2010 at 12:58 PM.
Old 08-01-2010, 01:34 PM   #2
ReapersCurse2
Member
 
ReapersCurse2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: NY
Posts: 449
ReapersCurse2 is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

T-up why not
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2010, 02:17 PM   #3
dsbn
Member
 
dsbn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: PH
Posts: 858
dsbn is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

I love Enigma. T-up
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2010, 02:49 PM   #4
MalTheAwesome
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 206
MalTheAwesome is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

Definitely. T-up
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2010, 05:06 PM   #5
Dynes
Member
 
Dynes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Philippines
Posts: 3,853
Blog Entries: 4
Dynes is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

What about a doom-like effect that does not disable experience gain?
Or trigger a pause that excludes invisible units?
__________________
Dynes: I don't believe you. /care
My suggestions on my blog.
I'll hand it over to DotA 2... for now.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2010, 06:58 PM   #6
Cheaterhater
Member
 
Cheaterhater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: GetUnitLoc(udg_Cheaterhater)
Posts: 1,630
Blog Entries: 3
Cheaterhater is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

Both pause and Doom have several side-effects which are apparently not intended by IceFrog (he could have uses Pause for a long time to completely disable the units if he wanted to). Also doom can't be cast on an already doomed unit, so it's hard to apply it correctly.
__________________
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 12:34 AM   #7
kristoferman
Member
 
kristoferman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 48
kristoferman is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

I also agree with this but i wanna ask, why is enigma's blackhole cooldown so long?
Also i think black hole should have Aghanim's sceptor upgrade that can at least lower the cooldown.
  Reply With Quote
Last edited by kristoferman; 08-02-2010 at 12:57 AM.
Old 08-02-2010, 12:52 AM   #8
Lotus V Eater
Member
 
Lotus V Eater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Borneo Island!
Posts: 3,180
Blog Entries: 4
Send a message via Yahoo to Lotus V Eater
Lotus V Eater is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

^^ hahaha because it is one of great AOE disabling spell?

@topic: hurmm definitely T-UP on your suggestion...
__________________
:It is no good to try to stop knowledge from going forward.
Ignorance is never better than knowledge:

Visit My Hero Idea Portfolio
I Do Accept Signature Request!

LOTUS V EATER'S HOMEMADE ICONS : CHECK IT OUT NOW!
  Reply With Quote
Last edited by Lotus V Eater; 08-02-2010 at 01:11 AM.
Old 08-02-2010, 01:08 AM   #9
kristoferman
Member
 
kristoferman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 48
kristoferman is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

Yea i get the disable part but faceless void also has a great ulti disable and at it' highest level u can cast it twice as much as blackhole at its highest level and also faceless void's ultimate last longer. also wat does T-UP mean? (im new to threads)
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 01:12 AM   #10
Lotus V Eater
Member
 
Lotus V Eater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Borneo Island!
Posts: 3,180
Blog Entries: 4
Send a message via Yahoo to Lotus V Eater
Lotus V Eater is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

void ulti does not deal damage, it is just disable...enigma black hole is disable + damage + silence
__________________
:It is no good to try to stop knowledge from going forward.
Ignorance is never better than knowledge:

Visit My Hero Idea Portfolio
I Do Accept Signature Request!

LOTUS V EATER'S HOMEMADE ICONS : CHECK IT OUT NOW!
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 01:14 AM   #11
kristoferman
Member
 
kristoferman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 48
kristoferman is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

hmmm thats true altho i never really understood how the damage is done on blackhole. I thot void ulti stops u completely so it sorta silences u at the same time.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 01:17 AM   #12
Lotus V Eater
Member
 
Lotus V Eater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Borneo Island!
Posts: 3,180
Blog Entries: 4
Send a message via Yahoo to Lotus V Eater
Lotus V Eater is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

it stops you and at the same time can stop your allies too...while black hole did not affect his allies as he pull the enemies only...
__________________
:It is no good to try to stop knowledge from going forward.
Ignorance is never better than knowledge:

Visit My Hero Idea Portfolio
I Do Accept Signature Request!

LOTUS V EATER'S HOMEMADE ICONS : CHECK IT OUT NOW!
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 01:20 AM   #13
kristoferman
Member
 
kristoferman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 48
kristoferman is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

hmmmm good point but if u use the void ulti and then u may trap 1 0r 2 allies but those extra seconds could kill the other team and since the cd is lower, u can use it alot sooner to finish them or to make them cry for the fountain. BTW do u know how the blackhole damage is dealt? Also blackhole is a channeling spell as well.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 01:26 AM   #14
Lotus V Eater
Member
 
Lotus V Eater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Borneo Island!
Posts: 3,180
Blog Entries: 4
Send a message via Yahoo to Lotus V Eater
Lotus V Eater is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

damage is dealt per sec right?
__________________
:It is no good to try to stop knowledge from going forward.
Ignorance is never better than knowledge:

Visit My Hero Idea Portfolio
I Do Accept Signature Request!

LOTUS V EATER'S HOMEMADE ICONS : CHECK IT OUT NOW!
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 01:27 AM   #15
kristoferman
Member
 
kristoferman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 48
kristoferman is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

idk bcuz everytime i use it the damage is barely noticable so i dont think that it is per second.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 01:30 AM   #16
Lotus V Eater
Member
 
Lotus V Eater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Borneo Island!
Posts: 3,180
Blog Entries: 4
Send a message via Yahoo to Lotus V Eater
Lotus V Eater is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

it is per sec...but differs based on the distance of the unit from your black hole = "70 damage at range, 140 damage close up" for 4 sec which make "total of 280 damage at range and total of 560 damage when close up"
__________________
:It is no good to try to stop knowledge from going forward.
Ignorance is never better than knowledge:

Visit My Hero Idea Portfolio
I Do Accept Signature Request!

LOTUS V EATER'S HOMEMADE ICONS : CHECK IT OUT NOW!
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 02:07 AM   #17
Kewken
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 92
Kewken is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

Obvious T-UP is obvious...
__________________
Bnet Champion pubbar.
Ye fools shall feel the wrath of me Divine Rapiar!
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 03:35 AM   #18
letarox
Member
 
letarox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 321
letarox is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

T-Up
__________________
WuD.DreN - Renato 'Letarox' Santos
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 05:03 AM   #19
kristoferman
Member
 
kristoferman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 48
kristoferman is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pink_Lotus View Post
it is per sec...but differs based on the distance of the unit from your black hole = "70 damage at range, 140 damage close up" for 4 sec which make "total of 280 damage at range and total of 560 damage when close up"
U got a point there lotus so i guess the cooldown is okay but i still go for the sceptor upgrade.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2010, 05:10 AM   #20
Terresquall
Member
 
Terresquall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 314
Blog Entries: 2
Terresquall is offline
Default Re: [FIX] A simple fix for Black Hole

Instead of silencing the units in Black Hole, why not just apply an invisible stun to all affected units? The idea is to completely immobilise a target, and I don't see why we should artificially create this through SetPosition and using a Silence spell when you can directly stun it and fix all spells getting through it once and for all.
  Reply With Quote
Reply
  Defense of the Ancients Suggestions Remakes


Forum Jump

Thread Tools