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Old 11-08-2010, 05:58 AM   #1
Captain Planet
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Default [ITEM] Emerald Orb




Emerald Orb

3275

Bought From :


A ghostly gem, taken from the Dread Gnomes, its power is second only to the Great Emerald on the Deltoran Belt.

Old
New
+7 strength/agility+10 strength/agility
+13 intelligence+15 intelligence
+10% attack speed+15 damage
+15 damage+80% mana regen
+75% mana regenGhost Sight (active)
Ghost Form (active) 
Ghost Scepter 1600
Oblivion Staff 1675
Ghost Sight - 100 mana cost
  • Turns hero Ethereal until item is deactivated
  • Grants hero True Sight until item is deactivated
  • Grants unobstructed vision in an 800 AoE
  • Lasts for a maximum of 10 seconds before the item automatically deactivates
  • Upon deactivation (manual or automatic) goes into a 45 second cooldown
  • True Sight is given in a 1000 AoE
Can be disassembled
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Last edited by Captain Planet; 05-01-2011 at 08:55 AM.
Old 11-08-2010, 06:46 AM   #2
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Is the ethereal here is the same with other ethereal effect?
I mean, can't deal and dealt physical damage?? and take bonus damage from spells?
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Old 11-08-2010, 06:51 AM   #3
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Yes. It's the same ethereal. I'm not aware of any other types of ethereal in WC3
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Old 11-08-2010, 06:53 AM   #4
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

I don't think that an item that costs this much for such little benefit should drop.
Compare
Gem of True Sight - 800g. Cheap but True sight, which in if you think about it, True Sight doesn't TOTALLY help kill enemy heroes.
Divine Rapier - 6200. ALOT of dps. Definitely helps kill, but COSTS ALOT.

Emerald Orb is essentially a Gem, but much more expensive.
Situation - whenever an enemy hero carries a gem isn't it most of the time that he is aimed at? This will be the same case for Emerald Orb, but instead of physical attacks, everyone will aim him with spells.
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:01 AM   #5
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Ok. I'll remove the "Drops on death"
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:12 AM   #6
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Agreed with GEB
it looks like suicide for me

when you want to see Riki, turn it on, and suddenly a Laguna Blade pass by and said "OMG am I killing a hero just now??"
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:15 AM   #7
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Removed dropping on death and added a passive.
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:20 AM   #8
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Still unreliable though :/ (read my illustration again)

better buy gem only and use 1900 gold from scepter and recipe to buy other item
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:25 AM   #9
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

^The difference being that you don't lose this when you die, so you save money in the long run because you don't have to keep rebuying it. In that sense it's more reliable than Gem.
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:37 AM   #10
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

oh sorry forgot the drop on death removal

OK so now it's a gem with new strategic usage
I can see a nuker using this though

but I think the pulse is kinda weird. 3.5 sec TS per 8 sec. Well it's just number issue though :/

anyway now it looks way better
how about changing the mechanism of "drop on death"??
Like this:
it have maybe 3 charges, whenever you die, it lose 1 charge. And if the charge runs out, you cannot use the active ability again, and must buy the recipe to gain a charge. You may re-charge the item to 3 again by buying recipe 3 times
what do you think??
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:49 AM   #11
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

I think that totally negates the reliability of this upgrade of Gem, because it creates an on-going cost, which would otherwise not be incurred. Gem has to be rebought (nearly always) when you die, whereas with this you don't have to, thus in the long run possibly saving money. I'm not sure forcing an on-going cost is wise.
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:56 AM   #12
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

1st - using gem in recipe is bad.
2nd - active is.. bad. it's not giving any major bonuses, it's almost like gem+scepter
3rd - removing of constant truesight? ok, pulse giving you truesight for 3,5 seconds each 8 seconds. strange. btw, passive is cool
t-null now. Only because of cool passive =)
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Old 11-08-2010, 08:23 AM   #13
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Sorry Juggy, but IMO this item has far too many holes too fix in order to make viable or worthwhile to buy.
1. Gem that doesn't Drop on death = T-Down
2. Pulse is far too unreliable, although can lead to more strategic timing of ganks (which is still very hard to pull off) = T-Null
3. Silence counters this = T-Down

Compared to:
Gem constant True sight + in-counter-able (Since even under silence, hex, or any other disable, it still works.)
This recipe would make it very unreliable.
T-Down
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Old 11-08-2010, 08:30 AM   #14
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

@1. This doesn't give sight all the time, hence no dropping.
@2. You've got Ghost Sight for that. This is a tactical item. Good against heroes like Riki, BM, Weaver, etc. It gives both immunity to their attacks and True Sight to see them, without the fear of losing TS if you should die.
@3. Removed.
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Old 11-08-2010, 08:33 AM   #15
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

^Then why do you include Gem of True Sight if this item doesn't grant permanent true Sight+ doesn't drop upon death
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Old 11-08-2010, 08:37 AM   #16
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoduc91 View Post
^Then why do you include Gem of True Sight if this item doesn't grant permanent true Sight+ doesn't drop upon death
Err...because not all items are the exact sum of their parts? Let's say Gem was implemented in a 6k recipe. Would YOU want that to drop on death? Raiper is different in that it's BALANCED by dropping on death. No other way to balance +250 damage. But this item is balanced by the fact that it's a more tactical item than "hurr hurr I has Gem, I pwn all you invis nubs nao". It's a situational item that works really well in specific situations. Like Ghost Scepter and Ethereal Blade, this item is situational like they are.

But if people don't like this, saying they don't like it and then not suggesting improvements doesn't *really* help
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:11 AM   #17
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

For Ethereal Blade, I always wanna a fix to allow Ethereal Blade carrier to cast it on himself (without the damage for sure) to transform to Ethereal Form in case the enemies are using BKB. Yes, Rapier is strong and balanced by the fact that it is dropped upon death. Then your item will destroy Gem of Truesight's strength and balance by not allowing it to drop upon death and losing permanent Truesight. If it doesn't have any special feature of Gem, why don't you remove it and change the recipe?
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:13 AM   #18
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

It's a trade off. You get a permanent item, but the True Sight is no longer permanent. It's about balance. As I've said. This item is a tactical choice. But I take your point. I might remake the item's recipe.

I'm thinking of using Dust of Appearance while keeping the basic theme. Any suggestions on how I should go about it?
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:21 AM   #19
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

I think that adding Dust will require you to make it charge-based. Why don't you just make a 1000-gold recipe to upgrade it from GS
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:22 AM   #20
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

What, keep the True Sight but not include Gem? Seems a little strange.
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:27 AM   #21
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

It is the same as buying Guinsoo, the Hex active magically appears from nowhere, same for Manta, etc:|
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Old 11-08-2010, 09:34 AM   #22
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Hmm...I'll try that.
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Old 11-08-2010, 10:28 AM   #23
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Em, no gem as recipe (i don't check changelog) ?

And the Gem pulse is unreliable imo since it pulse out every x seconds.
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Old 11-08-2010, 10:29 AM   #24
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaoS_ThronE View Post
Em, no gem as recipe (i don't check changelog) ?

And the Gem pulse is unreliable
No, no gem as recipe...your point?
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Old 11-08-2010, 10:40 AM   #25
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

I actually seems alot better now IMO, w/o Gem.
The passive ability seems a bit. . . eh? (i.e. T-Null, due to it's uncertainty/difficulty in timing when to charge in and gank).
The Active skill is amazing. It's like a visible, un-attackable ward, but balanced since spells will screw you over.
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Old 11-08-2010, 10:42 AM   #26
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Remove the passive, you think?
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Old 11-08-2010, 11:09 AM   #27
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Yeah, I think the active is cool, the passive seems quite redundant. I also think that you should make the active lasts for at most 5-6 seconds, so that it doesn't counter invisible hero too hard.
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Old 11-08-2010, 11:16 AM   #28
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Hmm. You think making it a toggle is too powerful? Remember that while it's active you'll take a bucket load of damage from spells, which I feel might be balance enough. I'll wait and see what others think, but I'll delete the passive.
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Old 11-08-2010, 11:56 AM   #29
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Making it a toggle is awesome, but a "deactivates if not engaged by enemy in x seconds" is necessary IMO. This completely shuts down Mortred and Slardar.
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Old 11-08-2010, 11:57 AM   #30
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

10 seconds?
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Old 11-08-2010, 11:58 AM   #31
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

7~8.
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Old 11-08-2010, 11:59 AM   #32
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

8 seconds it is then.
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Old 11-08-2010, 12:03 PM   #33
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

"Turning the item on/off triggers a 5 second cooldown"

Btw, after it shuts off, you can immediately activate it again. That needs a fix?
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Old 11-08-2010, 12:04 PM   #34
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Fixed
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Old 11-08-2010, 06:33 PM   #35
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

8 seconds is pretty long..

True sight sucks.. instant t-down for that. remove it..

the active without true sight is really cool though..
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Old 11-08-2010, 07:42 PM   #36
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Very cool and very risky item...
T-Up =]
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Old 11-09-2010, 08:49 AM   #37
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Much better than the previous one... Really interesting... But missing something, some special thing... Well one thing I know is that after your change the recipe (remove recipe and add smth else?) the missing part will be filled...
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Old 11-11-2010, 12:04 PM   #38
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Ok. Replaced recipe with Oblivion Staff and added extra bonuses. Also slightly buffed duration of Ghost Sight to compensate for the extra 675 gold cost.
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Old 11-11-2010, 12:25 PM   #39
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Hmmm,
Good idea for Stat Bonus' and On/off 5 second cooldown.
I'd make it free from any mana cost imo, it's risky enough as it is.
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Old 11-11-2010, 12:59 PM   #40
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Default Re: [ITEM] Emerald Orb

Hmm. Ok, I'll remove the mana cost and see what happens.
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