[Aghanims] Geomancer

[BiH-Kira]

I read this somewhere in Dota chat, but didn't found an actual suggestion here. I didn't want to let such a good suggestion go to waste.

I'm talking about a nice Aghanims upgrade for Meepo the Geomancer.

• Current Divided We Stand
• Suggested Divided We Stand
• How it works
• Changelog

Meepo summons an imperfect, semi-autonomous duplicate of himself, which can gain gold and experience as he does and shares his experience and abilities. However, the clones cannot wield any items but the boots that Meepo himself wears. If any of the clones die, they all die.

LvL 1 - Summons 1 clone.
LvL 2 - Summons 2 clones.
LvL 3 - Summons 3 clones.

Notes:

• The only item that transfers to the clones is one pair of boots (any type).
• Meepo clones can use active abilities from Boots of Travel and Phase Boots.
• Meepo clones gain 25% of any extra attributes the primary Meepo has.

Current Divided We Stand| Suggested Divided We Stand
Meepo summons an imperfect, semi-autonomous duplicate of himself, which can gain gold and experience as he does and shares his experience and abilities. However, the clones cannot wield any items but the boots that Meepo himself wears. If any of the clones die, they all die. (with a delay of 3/4/5 seconds)*

LvL 1 - Summons 1 clone.
LvL 2 - Summons 2 clones.
LvL 3 - Summons 3 clones.

Notes:

• The only item that transfers to the clones is one pair of boots (any type).
• Meepo clones can use active abilities from Boots of Travel and Phase Boots.
• Meepo clones gain 25% (35%)* of any extra attributes the primary Meepo has.
• Meepo clones will have the Aghanims icon in their inventory, but won't get any additional stats from it. Only the 35% from the primary Meepo.*
• A timer for the delay will appear above the primary Geomancer. It will be visible to the player and his allies. Enemies won't see it.
• When once of the Geomancer dies, the other won't give additional gold nor experience if killed before the timer goes to 0.
• Bounty and experience will be given after the timer goes to 0.

*Aghanims upgrade.

Now to the technical part. I really don't know how to code this, so I won't talk about that. I will talk about how it should be done.

Once the original Meepo picks Aghanims up, all of his clones and the clones that are created after that will have Aghanims icon in their inventory. It will be just and Icon and won't give any bonuses to the clones.

Clones get 25% of all stats that the original buys added to their own. Aghanims will increase that number by 10%, from 25 to 35%. This will be some small boost to the clones.

If one of the Meepos dies, not important if it's the original or a clone, the other meepos will die AFTER a set amount of time. More precisely, after 3/4/5 seconds, depending of his ultimate's level.

The bounty and experience won't be given at that moment, but after the delay. If the enemy manages to kill a second, third or forth Geomancer before the timer goes to 0, he won't be getting any additional gold or experience.

Not sure how this should be coded, but maybe something like this:
1 of the Geomancer's receives a finishing blow. Before he dies, the game will remove the dieing hero form the map and start a counter. If another hero is about to die, he also is removed form the game. Once the timer goes to 0, kill all remaining Geomancers and give gold and experience to the heroes which would have gotten it in the first place (the one who where there when the first Geo. died).

• 08.12.'10 - Thread posted.
• 09.12.'10 - Added a counter for the delay after 1 Geomancer dies.
• 09.01.'11 - Added some new notes to clarify how and when the experience and bounty for killing Meepo is gained.
• 09.01.'11 - Increased the stat gain of the clones by another 5%. Now it increases the stat gain from 25% to 35%.
• 09.01.'11 - Added a how it works tab.

We all know what Meepo's problem is. He is too fragile for the current line ups. Even without this current line ups he's hard to play because of his required high micromanagement.
Instagibing 1 is GG for Meepo. And with the current picks that's easily done.

This aghanims upgrade would be a great luxury item if he doesn't manage to finish the game before late game, preventing him from being free food. If you have a hard mid game, it can be considered even then.

The bonuses are great, but there are better items to consider as core or first luxury items, therefore it won't be a "must get aghanims" upgrade. It's more of a "Plan B items" when plan A fails. A great deal considering the cost of Aghanims.

I'm not sure about the additional stats he gains. Since people are complaining that "just" 5% is little, I increased it now to additional 10%. Now it's 35% of the originals stats. Hopefully this will be enough. I don't like increasing numbers to much, especially if I can't test it my self.

Feel free to replay and tell me your opinion. Please, explain your opinion to help me improve the suggestion. if you don't like the suggestion, please tell me why. That's the only way to improve DotA.

[invul_nerable]

Hmmm... its good a few seconds delay for your death seems nice(makes you kill the fucking killer yeah!) and the stat percentage increase is also reasonable

How bout giving it a subskill like divide(you know split meepos) and stand(make meepos combine) im still a fan of that idea.

[Redeemed A.I.]

I give null for the delay.Must see more suggestions.

So with aghanim's I have 5 % extra stats and also aghanim's hp/mp/+10 status on clones right?

[Yendor]

Originally Posted by Redeemed A.I.

I give null for the delay.Must see more suggestions.

So with aghanim's I have 5 % extra stats and also aghanim's hp/mp/+10 status on clones right?

READ The suggestion before you post!!!


Meepo clones will have the Aghanims icon in their inventory, but won't get any additional stats from it. Only the 30% from the primary Meepo.*

They ONLY get +5% stats.
NOT the +10 all stats and NOT the HP and NOT the MP of Agha.

BUT
If one Meepo dies, the rest lifes for 3/4/5 extra seconds.

[Redeemed A.I.]

Then it sucks balls.

Next!

[Yendor]

Originally Posted by Redeemed A.I.

Then it sucks balls.

Next!

You do know that meepo can kill many other heroes in those 5 seconds?

Have you ever played him?
Or do you just talk without reading the suggestion/playing the hero?

Baisically it's a 5 seconds of invulnerability, as the other team will not want to use their stuff on somebody that is already dead.

I T-UP this suggestion.

[Kumpel]

Really nice suggestion! T-up

tough i'm not certain about the +5% stats, as they have about to no impact..

[xiiaosin89]

This is weird... but I wish to have Agha Upg for all dota hero ;'(

MeePwn are actually for good micro-er (Its one of my favourite hero)
If someone that don't micro well and buy agha, maybe is okay. But if someone that micro well and buy agha, that's a big problem as it may be too imba

Maybe we can change the 3/4/5 delay to something else. For a good micro-er to buy agha (for the 3/4/5 delay) when using MeePwn will own :O

[BiH-Kira]

Originally Posted by Redeemed A.I.

I give null for the delay.Must see more suggestions.

So with aghanim's I have 5 % extra stats and also aghanim's hp/mp/+10 status on clones right?

As said, the 5 seconds are enough to kill at least 1 more hero IF you played right. So the delay is a good part.

About Aghanims, no you don't get the stats directly from the item. The clones get only the icon without any effect. That's because if you see a lone clone, you can see if the main one has Aghanims or not. Like a "don't touch me" sign above it's head.

The additional stat increase for the clones is increased from 25% to 30%.
Not a big difference. From Aghanims, your clones get 3 of each stats instead of 2.5.
Not a that big difference, but combined with the death delay, it's maybe too much. On 100 stats, that's 5 stats difference. The additional 5% is just to buy votes. :P
Kidding, just a small buff if you're in no need for the delay.

This is weird... but I wish to have Agha Upg for all dota hero ;'(

MeePwn are actually for good micro-er (Its one of my favourite hero)
If someone that don't micro well and buy agha, maybe is okay. But if someone that micro well and buy agha, that's a big problem as it may be too imba

Maybe we can change the 3/4/5 delay to something else. For a good micro-er to buy agha (for the 3/4/5 delay) when using MeePwn will own :O

Even if you are the ultimate microer, a Lina will simply one shot you. 'MeePwn' is countered by instant nukes. His strength is his weakness. So i just made the weakness be delayed or a bit.

[fan.god]

t-up. the best suggestion for meepo aghanim imo. and i think aghanim really fits his item build (vlad, mesk...). it somehow solves meepo's fragility: when people see him, they know to focus on one clone meepo and then he will be gone. not anymore. in a good hand, with 5 more seconds he can damage a lot.
i suggest adding a countdown so that the player know how much time he has left.
and maybe a few stats for clone meepos?? i really wanna see him again

[pokesam94]

T-up i saw this on the forums somewhere else too

[NoThlnG]

T-Up. Though I prefer the one that makes Aghanim shared

[Captain Planet]

No. I've only seen one suggestion for Meepo Aghanim's that I think has a chance of being implemented, and that was Aequinox's suggestion where the upgrade is that All clone Meepos get Aghanim's in their inventory, getting both full stats from it AND the 25% extra from the head Meepo as well. Best and cleanest suggestion I've seen. This feels weird and strange. What can you normally do in 3/4/5 seconds than you couldn't do in the previous 10-15 seconds other than the rare final hit to get a mutual kill?

[Nanaya Shiki]

Originally Posted by NoThlnG

Though I prefer the one that makes Aghanim shared

Me too but it would be imba.

[Captain Planet]

Originally Posted by Pokokichi2

Me too but it would be imba.

Um...trolol?

Lemme put people's minds at ease. Firstly, I automatically tell anyone who thinks Meepo is imba are either stupid or trolling (you haven't specifically said that though so it's ok ).

Secondly, this item costs 4200g when Meepo has other items he badly needs (Mek, Vlads, Pipe, TREADS), so it's only for the late game, which is the time when Meepo's shine is long since gone. This item would give his clones the following HP:
390hp + 25% = 487.5hp. Considering Meepo's health is never particularly high, does that figure REALLY scream "OMFG MEEPO IS IMBA!!!! HE'S GOT 480 EXTRA HP!!!1!one.?"
They'd also get 130 + 25% = 162.5 mana. Is that IMBA as well?
Or what about the 12.5% IAS the clones would get? Is that IMBA as well, now?

–.–

L2mathscraft, people, before opening your mouths to shout IMBA!!

[GEBnaman]

Problem is with the bounty and exp.

Would it mean that if you kill one meepo, and manage to kill another within the 3 seconds, that's a second bounty and more exp?

[Kriegskanzler]

T-Up on the Bonus upgrade, T-Null on the death delay.

[Nanaya Shiki]

Originally Posted by The ][nquisitor

Um...trolol?

Lemme put people's minds at ease. Firstly, I automatically tell anyone who thinks Meepo is imba are either stupid or trolling (you haven't specifically said that though so it's ok ).

Secondly, this item costs 4200g when Meepo has other items he badly needs (Mek, Vlads, Pipe, TREADS), so it's only for the late game, which is the time when Meepo's shine is long since gone. This item would give his clones the following HP:
390hp + 25% = 487.5hp. Considering Meepo's health is never particularly high, does that figure REALLY scream "OMFG MEEPO IS IMBA!!!! HE'S GOT 480 EXTRA HP!!!1!one.?"
They'd also get 130 + 25% = 162.5 mana. Is that IMBA as well?
Or what about the 12.5% IAS the clones would get? Is that IMBA as well, now?

–.–

L2mathscraft, people, before opening your mouths to shout IMBA!!

Seriously, if he rushed Aghanim, and he would use it, wouldn't he imba? Aghanim already gives nice stats, and if all his clones (2 clones at early-mid) had it too, it wouldn't be imba?
L2mathscraft, people, before opening your mouths to shout NOT IMBA!!
And if that suggestion were perfect, Ice Frog would implement it for sure.

[Captain Planet]

Originally Posted by Pokokichi2

Seriously, if he rushed Aghanim, and he would use it, wouldn't he imba? Aghanim already gives nice stats, and if all his clones (2 clones at early-mid) had it too, it wouldn't be imba?
L2mathscraft, people, before opening your mouths to shout NOT IMBA!!
And if that suggestion were perfect, Ice Frog would implement it for sure.

Seriously? If ANY luxury item is rushed it's imba. Have you seen any Jackfrog replays? He will often rush Radiance and believe you me it's well and truly IMBA at the time he gets it. This would be no difference. Any luxury item is imba when rushed. I don't think "when rushed it will be imba" qualifies as making an item ACTUALLY imbalanced.

And besides, even if I did want to rush this on Meepo, I'd still want Mekansm before I got this, hence rushing it isn't really an option for Meepo.

[Nanaya Shiki]

Originally Posted by The ][nquisitor

Seriously? If ANY luxury item is rushed it's imba. Have you seen any Jackfrog replays? He will often rush Radiance and believe you me it's well and truly IMBA at the time he gets it. This would be no difference. Any luxury item is imba when rushed. I don't think "when rushed it will be imba" qualifies as making an item ACTUALLY imbalanced.

And besides, even if I did want to rush this on Meepo, I'd still want Mekansm before I got this, hence rushing it isn't really an option for Meepo.

Getting Aghanim is 3x easier than Radiance. And Aghanim is already an item with easy build-up. You dont have to rush it.