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Old 12-31-2010, 11:51 AM   #1
Lithary
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Lightbulb Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]


• Ordinary Staff •




•Description •

An item formed out of 4 Quarterstaffs, duh!

• Recipe •

• Quarterstaff x 4 (900 x 4 gold) •
• Ordinary Staff Recipe (650 gold) •

• Total: 4250 gold

• Bonuses •

• +40 attack damage •
• +40% IAS •
• Block (passive) •
• Overhead Toss (active) •

• Details •

• Block •
Blocks an attack, has 5 sec CD (a 100% 100000000 damage block, but with cooldown activated after it block one hit - imagine Linken Sphere's Spell Block, but that it works on physical attacks instead).
Works only on successful attacks, so attacks that miss will not trigger this ability.

• Overhead Toss •
Stabs an unit up to 300 units away from you with the staff and tosses it 300 units behind the caster.
Upon landing, the unit deals 150 physical damage (normal type) in 200 AOE and takes 150 physical damage (normal type) itself.
All damaged units will be also stunned for 1 second.
Has cooldown of 25 seconds and mana cost of 75 MP.
Targeting type is unit.
Can target allies, but they won't get damaged or stunned when they land (enemies around them will).


Changelog:
• January the 4th, 2011:
- Reduced slow of Overhead Toss from 35 to 25%.
- Decreased damage bonus from 50 to 40 and decreased IAS bonus from 50% to 40%.


• January the 18th, 2011:
- Reduced damage dealt to tossed unit from 200 to 150 physical damage and units this tossed unit is being tossed at from 200 to 150 physical damage.

• April the 5th, 2011:
- Removed slow from Overhead Toss, but increased stun duration from 0.5 to 1 second and reduced cooldown from 35 to 25 seconds.

• May the 11th, 2012:
- Added a new icon taken from here.


____________________________________

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Last edited by Lithary; 05-11-2012 at 02:08 AM.
Old 01-01-2011, 05:29 AM   #2
GEBnaman
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

It's like giving everyone Tiny's 'Toss' ability...

Damage has to be nerfed to a point where the Ability is obviously better than the Item ability. (That's the rule of thumb I go by when item abilities imitate heroes)

Overall, 'Toss' is a very versatile ability that anyone and everyone can and should be able to benefit from.

Simple concept T-up

EDIT: This is almost NOTHING like Toss, but is still similar...T-up =P
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Old 01-01-2011, 06:05 AM   #3
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

How bout taking away the recipe cost?
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Old 01-01-2011, 07:00 AM   #4
Nerubian Weaver
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

For 650 gold you squeeze four items into one slot, +10 attack & +10% IAS (A quarterstaff has this for 900 gold), as well as a double-edge-like active -- I actually like this -- and a physical attack block which is uncodeable since you can't detect damage type nor misses/bashes/crits/etc.

Remove the passive and the recipe, and change the +ATK and +IAS to 40 - 45.

T-NULL
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Old 01-01-2011, 03:47 PM   #5
Lithary
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by GEBnaman View Post
It's like giving everyone Tiny's 'Toss' ability...

Damage has to be nerfed to a point where the Ability is obviously better than the Item ability. (That's the rule of thumb I go by when item abilities imitate heroes)

Overall, 'Toss' is a very versatile ability that anyone and everyone can and should be able to benefit from.

Simple concept T-up

EDIT: This is almost NOTHING like Toss, but is still similar...T-up =P
True, I agree that item's ability shouldn't be better than original ability (even though Dagon is an exception for that, but that's why you pay awfully lot of money for it).
Still, I think that it's inferior to original Toss in almost every way.
I'll leave it be as it is, for now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by McCannilbal View Post
How bout taking away the recipe cost?
Than it would be too good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sartaglo View Post
For 650 gold you squeeze four items into one slot, +10 attack & +10% IAS (A quarterstaff has this for 900 gold), as well as a double-edge-like active -- I actually like this -- and a physical attack block which is uncodeable since you can't detect damage type nor misses/bashes/crits/etc.

Remove the passive and the recipe, and change the +ATK and +IAS to 40 - 45.

T-NULL
Hmmm...
How about make it work something like Refraction then?
That it gives you a single instance of damage block every X seconds (with maximum being of 1 instance at the time) or something like that.
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Last edited by Lithary; 01-01-2011 at 03:58 PM.
Old 01-02-2011, 09:58 AM   #6
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

T-UP on concept
T-Down on numbers

I find the numbers too imbalance, maybe increasing the cooldown or decrease the slow % will be good
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Old 01-04-2011, 06:57 PM   #7
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by xiiaosin89 View Post
T-UP on concept
T-Down on numbers

I find the numbers too imbalance, maybe increasing the cooldown or decrease the slow % will be good
Well, I'll reduce slow from 35 to 25% and see what happens.
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Old 01-18-2011, 10:56 AM   #8
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

This is not a bump!
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Old 01-18-2011, 01:04 PM   #9
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by xiiaosin89 View Post
T-UP on concept
T-Down on numbers
This.
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Old 01-18-2011, 03:33 PM   #10
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Works only on successful attacks, so attacks that miss will not trigger this ability
As far as I know checking miss or evade on attacking is impossible.
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Old 01-18-2011, 03:49 PM   #11
Lithary
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Only View Post
This.
Nerfed numbers a bit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian AngeL View Post
As far as I know checking miss or evade on attacking is impossible.
How comes that Overload doesn't discharge if attack misses?
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Last edited by Lithary; 03-29-2011 at 03:46 PM.
Old 03-29-2011, 03:46 PM   #12
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Bump with sugar on top!
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Old 03-31-2011, 08:22 PM   #13
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

I actually like it, although damage seems pointless especially at the point when you get this item. Maybe....

As for coding:

Every 5 seconds, activate a 100% evasion.
If hero is targeted
If hero takes damage
Loop (back to start)
Else
Turn off evasion
Else
End


IDK how JASS works but this is pretty much how the coding would work with typical OO coding.
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Old 03-31-2011, 08:41 PM   #14
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

I like the blocking attack idea, reminds me of a game called Nox where your staff would block attacks (at least until it broke, lol, durability went quit fast blocking ogre attacks with it) I dunno about the toss though, seems unnecessary add on.
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Old 03-31-2011, 08:54 PM   #15
-Groove.Mike-
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian AngeL View Post
As far as I know checking miss or evade on attacking is impossible.
You are actually right.
In DotA, there's no damage detection system.
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Old 04-01-2011, 01:41 AM   #16
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by -Groove.Mike- View Post
You are actually right.
In DotA, there's no damage detection system.
You can check if you're targeted by an attack and you can check for reduction in health, so just make a 100% evasion, check for attack, and if attack occurs and there is no reduction in health, turn off evasion.
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Old 04-03-2011, 01:37 PM   #17
Lithary
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by doomed2die View Post
I actually like it, although damage seems pointless especially at the point when you get this item. Maybe....

As for coding:

Every 5 seconds, activate a 100% evasion.
If hero is targeted
If hero takes damage
Loop (back to start)
Else
Turn off evasion
Else
End


IDK how JASS works but this is pretty much how the coding would work with typical OO coding.
Well, I don't know about how Block should work.
Linken's Sphere Spell Block was there just for an example.
Still, I think that this is a good idea since it is new and reliable way of blocking damage.

Edit:
Maybe something like 100% Backtrack can be used in case 100% Evasion is not possible?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonEsteban View Post
I like the blocking attack idea, reminds me of a game called Nox where your staff would block attacks (at least until it broke, lol, durability went quit fast blocking ogre attacks with it) I dunno about the toss though, seems unnecessary add on.
Actually, it is very useful.
I had the idea and before I've put it, I've asked myself 'For what it could be used?' and I figured it that this could be pretty nice escaping and chasing tool (not to mention for ganking).
When running, if some enemy hero blocks your way and you are being chased by other enemy heroes, you can toss that hero in front of you, hit those heroes behind you and slow them witch will give you nice advantage when running away.
Similar is when chasing.
You toss enemy hero behind you right into your allies jaws.

Block and Overhead Toss are two skills that seem quite unique, effective and fitting skills for Ordinary Staff to have and that's why I have put them there.
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Last edited by Lithary; 04-04-2011 at 04:38 AM.
Old 04-04-2011, 01:05 PM   #18
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Imo, nerf either block or toss (or maybe both). One item with those gosu effects will surely make it on intiators almost always. If I had to chose, I'd take away the slow/Ministun from toss -- too many effects imo.

T-null for now.
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Old 04-05-2011, 08:52 AM   #19
Lithary
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unan1mous View Post
Imo, nerf either block or toss (or maybe both). One item with those gosu effects will surely make it on intiators almost always. If I had to chose, I'd take away the slow/Ministun from toss -- too many effects imo.

T-null for now.
I think I'll remove slow, but increase stun to 1 sec.
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Old 04-07-2011, 07:40 AM   #20
Drikam
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by doomed2die View Post
I actually like it, although damage seems pointless especially at the point when you get this item. Maybe....

As for coding:

Every 5 seconds, activate a 100% evasion.
If hero is targeted
If hero takes damage
Loop (back to start)
Else
Turn off evasion
Else
End


IDK how JASS works but this is pretty much how the coding would work with typical OO coding.
or 100% chance to block 2623642623626235234 damage.
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Old 04-07-2011, 09:17 AM   #21
Lithary
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drikam View Post
or 100% chance to block 2623642623626235234 damage.
Imbaaaaa!!!
2623642623626235233 is much better.
Y u haz no balance sense!1?
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Old 05-07-2011, 06:35 AM   #22
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

T- down it is over power and the price is to low
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Old 05-07-2011, 08:47 AM   #23
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metaldeath View Post
T- down it is over power and the price is to low
How is it OP and too expensive?
Please give reasons to support it.

T-up. Good concept (based on Quarterstaff's description, lol ) and interesting effects. =)
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Old 05-17-2011, 05:53 PM   #24
Lithary
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Default Re: Ordinary Staff [Ancient Weaponry]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metaldeath View Post
T- down it is over power and the price is to low
Troll much?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaibo1 View Post
T-up. Good concept (based on Quarterstaff's description, lol ) and interesting effects. =)
Well, I tried to do something relatively new, useful and that it fits the item.
These are effects I came up with.
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