[STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God

KyonoRocks · 01-17-2011, 01:47 PM

Hi everyone,

This is my first hero suggestion in a long time, since Girok the Tuskarr Patriarch (who I still want reviews for btw!). I wanted to really plan out this one, and I documented my thoughts as I created this hero from the original question of 'What new hero does DotA need?'

The complete story is on my blog here. So if you fancy reading it, and how I created the hero, then check it out.

Download test map here.

HAND OF THE OLD GOD
Idol

568

/

260

Strength

-Agility

Intelligence

_____

22 + 2.2

-12 + 1.5

20 + 2.3

This would be recoloured gold

Consecrating Spear A divine ray of power strikes the target and consecrates the ground they walk on. This spreads to nearby enemies and damage is amplified on those affected.
Divine Shield of Vengeance The almighty grants Idol a shield which protects against the heathens. His divine presence consumes nearby foes with awe, silencing them as the energy is released.
Forced Tribute His supreme power causes an enemy to grant the Idol their power for a short duration.
Omnipresence The vengeful God is everywhere and nowhere. Teleports Idol to the target location and leaves a lingering shade of His power.

Affiliation: Neutral _____ Attack Animation: 0.5 / 0.5
Damage: 53 - 59 Casting Animation: 0.0 / 0.0
Armor: 4.71 Base Attack Time: 1.7
Movespeed: 310 Missile Speed: 900;
Attack Range: 400; Ranged Sight Range: 1800 / 800

Idol is a powerful support ganker, with the unique ability to appear in lane while actually plotting a gank attempt. His ability to shut down a single target's magic capabilities is unparalleled; with spell immunity, a silence and a mana drain. He specializes in disabling disablers and mana using carries (like Medusa). His damage amplification dissuades enemy allies from helping their teammates, while his mana drain cripples spell combos. His global presence seeks to stop solo farmers in their tracks, and the threat of Idol is a powerful psychological weapon

Once feared and praised by all life, the old God has been forsaken for centuries. Displeased with paganist beliefs and the worship of false dieties, He has decided to intervene. Through His holy contruct; Idol, the old God seeks to persecute the heathens and ensure that the world no longer blasphemes against His way.

		Consecrating Spear_________		A divine ray of power strikes the target and consecrates the ground they walk on. This spreads to nearby enemies and damage is amplified on those affected.
		Ability Type:		Active
		Targets:		Enemy
		Ability Hotkey:

Level	Mana Cost	Cooldown	Casting Range	Area of Effect	Duration	Allowed Targets	Effects
1	125	15	600	125	10	Enemy	Deals 90 true damage to the target and amplifies damage by 3% for each second enemies stand in the consecrated ground.
2	150	15	600	125	10	Enemy	Deals 160 true damage on the target and amplifies damage by 3% for each second enemies stand in the consecrated ground.
3	175	15	600	125	10	Enemy	Deals 230 true damage to the target and amplifies damage by 3% for each second enemies stand in the consecrated ground.
4	200	15	600	125	10	Enemy	Deals 300 true damage to the target and amplifies damage by 3% for each second enemies stand in the consecrated ground.

Notes

Like Spectre's Spectral Dagger, this leaves a trail which applies the debuff

		Divine Shield of Vengeance_________		The almighty grants Idol a shield which protects against the heathens. His divine presence consumes nearby foes with awe, silencing them as the energy is released.
		Ability Type:		Active
		Targets:		Self
		Ability Hotkey:

Level	Mana Cost	Cooldown	Casting Range	Area of Effect	Duration	Allowed Targets	Effects
1	75	22	N/A	275	5/2	Self	Grants spell immunity for 5 seconds, silencing enemies around Idol for 2 seconds upon expiry.
2	75	20	N/A	275	5/3	Self	Grants spell immunity for 5 seconds, silencing enemies around Idol for 3 seconds upon expiry.
3	75	18	N/A	275	5/4	Self	Grants spell immunity for 5 seconds, silencing enemies around Idol for 4 seconds upon expiry.
4	75	15	N/A	275	5/5	Self	Grants spell immunity for 5 seconds, silencing enemies around Idol for 5 seconds upon expiry.

Notes

Note

		Forced Tribute_________		His supreme power causes an enemy to grant the Idol their power for a short duration.
		Ability Type:		Active
		Targets:		Enemy
		Ability Hotkey:

Level	Mana Cost	Cooldown	Casting Range	Area of Effect	Duration	Allowed Targets	Effects
1	0	20	600	N/A	3	Enemy	Steals the greater value of 100 mana or 20% of target enemy’s maximum mana pool. Mana is returned to the target after 3 seconds.
2	0	18	600	N/A	4	Enemy	Steals the greater value of 200 mana or 30% of target enemy’s maximum mana pool. Mana is returned to the target after 4 seconds.
3	0	16	600	N/A	5	Enemy	Steals the greater value of 300 mana or 40% of target enemy’s maximum mana pool. Mana is returned to the target after 5 seconds.
4	0	14	600	N/A	5	Enemy	Steals the greater value of 400 mana or 50% of target enemy’s maximum mana pool. Mana is returned to the target after 5 seconds.

Notes

Returned mana is not taken from Idol, it is just restored to the target. He keeps the mana.

		Omnipresence_________		The vengeful God is everywhere and nowhere. Teleports Idol to the target location and leaves a lingering shade of His power.
		Ability Type:		Active
		Targets:		No target
		Ability Hotkey:

Level

Mana Cost

Cooldown

Casting Range

Area of Effect

Duration

Allowed Targets

Effects

1

150 (initial) 60/s

180

Global

N/A

Indefinite

No target

Teleports Idol to the target location and leaves behind an exact illusion of itself.

2

120 (initial) 70/s

150

Global

N/A

Indefinite

No target

Teleports Idol to the target location and leaves behind an exact illusion of itself.

3

100 (initial) 80/s

120

Global

N/A

Indefinite

No target

Teleports Idol to the target location and leaves behind an exact illusion of itself.

Notes

Mana per second is the cost of maintaining the illusion. Once toggled off, the illusion will be destroyed

Reviewed by:

None

Template by The_Juggernaught.
Made using Saguine's Hero Maker

PuЪLiㄷEиəℳy#1 · 01-17-2011, 02:18 PM

Icon for the second skill...

SpiderPig · 01-17-2011, 02:18 PM

really good hero

KyonoRocks · 01-18-2011, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PuЪLiㄷEиəℳy#1

Icon for the second skill...

Thanks for the suggestion. It fits well but kinda think it's a bit too similar to the 3rd icon.

ReaC · 01-18-2011, 08:51 AM

i think his 4th skill manacost is kinda too much since he's a strength hero. how bout 6/7/8%??? dat will do

hmmm... i dont see any other flaws in this hero and all his anti-caster skills are very simple and welcome

i dont know what to give, maybe a t-null or t-up?

Lotus V Eater · 01-18-2011, 10:25 AM

the illusion created when you cast Omnipresent can attack and sort of like the normal illusion right?

KyonoRocks · 01-18-2011, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by P_L[Maniac]

the illusion created when you cast Omnipresent can attack and sort of like the normal illusion right?

Yeah it's a total copy, hence the massive mana upkeep. It needs to be an identical clone so enemies believe it's still Idol, but it can't be abused and turn him into a carry

KyonoRocks · 01-19-2011, 01:22 PM

Added a link to my blog post about this hero at the top. I decided I wanted to plan, brainstorm and do this hero suggestion as professionally as possible... so if you're interested in the 'Why?' check it out!

Lotus V Eater · 01-19-2011, 02:58 PM

well, i still don't understand why this hero is a STR hero...when i think he can be an amazing INT carry...well, the current DotA map do lack that kind of role...

KyonoRocks · 01-20-2011, 11:13 AM

I felt that this hero could be strength or intelligence (definitely not agility, it's a freakin statue). For balance reasons, I think making him intelligence would be unwise. He's not intended to be a carry (I don't like carries tbh), so if he was intelligence he could stack intelligence and pump up his attack damage AND his available mana pool. Strength means that he can still stack intelligence (a bit like Earthshaker), but he won't become this absolute monster when he uses his ultimate.

The ultimate is primarily meant as a ganking tool. A way to be missing from a lane but the opponent doesn't know it yet. It has a side-function of acting like a very short term 2x damage boost (doubles your attack damage), which serves him late game or in team battles, but my intention for him to be a ganker and not a carry means I had to stick a high mana cost on it.

I do agree that intelligence suits him more, in that he has to stack mana if he wants to abuse Omnipresence, so it could be changed. I just feel it would turn him into a carry, when I don't want him to play that role. What is interesting, is when ganking ends at late game, he does kinda fall into that carry role naturally. Being strength, it takes longer, but with the items you'll be getting it's likely that he'll be able to keep Omnipresence active for 10+ seconds if you get 2000 mana and use Forced Tribute. This would be pretty late game though, so he's unique in that he's a super-duper hard carry (in that he needs TONS of items to carry), but he plays a completely different role until that point.

Lotus V Eater · 01-20-2011, 11:19 AM

hahaha very well-answered indeed....XD i think it is very awesome if you makes your illusion affected by the buffs from your spell as well, as to increase the "believing feeling" of your enemies about the illusion. (ie: when you cast the 2nd skill, and later the ulti, your illusion will gain the 2nd skill buff as well)

God of Death · 01-20-2011, 11:48 AM

Yo, awesome concept, cool skills.

The only problem I see is with the manastealing; your hero doesn't have low cooldown skills that he can chainspam after stealing mana for 5 seconds. Hence, this leads to a fixed playstyle where you have to cast the third skill first before spamming everything else. Apart from the ultimate.

About the ultimate, now, this has potential. A lot of it. Why not dramatically reduce the cooldown, and add a cap on maximum illusions maintainable? Something like 80/60/40 second cooldown for the Blink. After all, it's an ultimate.

And just some ideas; how about giving the copy access to all the skills? As in, they share cooldown for the skills, but either can cast. They also share manapools, or share 50% of their manapool [50% of the change in one is reflected in the other]. And IMO needs a reduction in the mana upkeep.

Otherwise, this hero is pretty awesome.

KyonoRocks · 01-21-2011, 04:44 PM

Thanks for the feedback GoD

My problem with any changes to the ultimate is that it changes the role of the hero. The problem with the illusion is that technically it's the strongest illusion creation ability in the game. Even Morphling has a 50% damage reduction on his clone and Terrorblade has a 300% damage taken increase (and 55% damage). The reason for a massive, massive upkeep is so it cannot be used like this... at least until the very late game.

Any changes to mana, health or damage intake/output could jeopardize the effectiveness of the clone in its role as deception.

I love the idea of having multiple clones, really gives a great thematic feel to Omnipresence (he really is everywhere at all times). But I'm unsure how to do this, and balance it, without spoiling the original intention of the skill; deception.

Here's an idea I just got... how about the clones start with 100% damage and stats, but after 5 seconds they convert into paper thin regular illusions. In this way, it works for the deception but also allows me to 'spam' clones and reduce the mana cost because they'll be easily destroyable after a few seconds. Will be complicated to describe, but it might work.

The implications of being able to have up to 3 or 4 clones are quite daunting! It would turn him into a mini-Meepo without the risk factor (actually, it would be a Meepo with ALL copied items... like Lone Druid with 3-4 bears!). The micro would be pretty intense, especially if players used the original motivation (deception) and used all their clones to confuse the hell out of the enemy team.

Of course, a problem with that would be their use as free wards.

Lots of food for thought! More feedback would still be much appreciated!

ExValentine · 01-21-2011, 08:47 PM

Although the Ult is really mana heavy (I'm guessing you want him to be a caster of sorts), you could say that Orchid of Malevolence would be crucial in the item build. The oblivion staff that is used to make it is all about mana regen and added damage (a bit of extra attack speed, but that will help Idol too). So, you can gradually increase mana regen while still gaining damage, attack speed and intelligence.

Great hero btw.

KyonoRocks · 01-23-2011, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ExValentine

Although the Ult is really mana heavy (I'm guessing you want him to be a caster of sorts), you could say that Orchid of Malevolence would be crucial in the item build. The oblivion staff that is used to make it is all about mana regen and added damage (a bit of extra attack speed, but that will help Idol too). So, you can gradually increase mana regen while still gaining damage, attack speed and intelligence.

Great hero btw.

Thanks!

Yeah Orchid Malevolence would be a perfect item. The damage amplification will also cause some serious pain on the targets of Consecrating Spear, especially with the increased attack speed and damage of both Idol and his clone.

KyonoRocks · 01-27-2011, 10:02 AM

Thinking about changing the ultimate to be much more castable, expanding the illusion confusion theme. Just bumping to get some more feedback before I do so!

Help a brotha out, yo!

Loup · 01-29-2011, 07:59 PM

Came here to suggest a more "Old Gods" oriented theme, but I don't think I will after being convinced that, for that, you would need to change the whole concept of the hero. But, amazing hero, with incredible gameplay and marvelous abilities.

About the ulti, it's hard to say, but I'll think of something.

P.S.: I tried to comment at your blog, but it was rejected... I think. Would you take a look on whatever is causing this?

KyonoRocks · 01-30-2011, 04:47 PM

Thanks a lot for the kind comments, glad you like the idea.

Regarding the blog, weird! I had one comment from some guy called indorser but I've checked the auto-spam box and haven't had anything else. Try again if you like, it should email me when I have to approve a comment.

Loup · 01-30-2011, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KyonoRocks

Thanks a lot for the kind comments, glad you like the idea.
Quite, I liked the reasoning behind it. The hero came as amazing as your arguments for it's existence

Regarding the blog, weird! I had one comment from some guy called indorser but I've checked the auto-spam box and haven't had anything else. Try again if you like, it should email me when I have to approve a comment.
Well, when I tried to comment, the server became suddenlly offline xD It was really surprising.

Well, I'll type my Ulti idea when I come back, I need to get out of comp ASAP xD

KyonoRocks · 02-24-2011, 02:09 AM

Necro bump! Since it's been almost a month, thought I'd give it one.

01-17-2011, 02:18 PM	#2
PuЪLiㄷEиəℳy#1 Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Philippines Posts: 4,585	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God Icon for the second skill... __________________ My FanFics Archive PDFF&L's Newest RPG PuЪLiㄷEиəℳy#1's FanFictions

01-17-2011, 02:18 PM	#3
SpiderPig Banned Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: In my home. Posts: 3,806	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God really good hero

01-18-2011, 08:51 AM	#5
ReaC Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Philippines Posts: 229	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God i think his 4th skill manacost is kinda too much since he's a strength hero. how bout 6/7/8%??? dat will do hmmm... i dont see any other flaws in this hero and all his anti-caster skills are very simple and welcome i dont know what to give, maybe a t-null or t-up? __________________ I reviewed yours, pls review mine... VENTUS, WILD ZEPHYR RUN, HIT, THEN KILL!!! OTHERS

01-18-2011, 10:25 AM	#6
Lotus V Eater Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Borneo Island! Posts: 4,806 Blog Entries: 4	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God the illusion created when you cast Omnipresent can attack and sort of like the normal illusion right? __________________ :It is no good to try to stop knowledge from going forward. Ignorance is never better than knowledge: Visit My Hero Idea Portfolio I Do Accept Signature Request! LOTUS V EATER'S HOMEMADE ICONS : CHECK IT OUT NOW!

01-19-2011, 01:22 PM	#8
KyonoRocks Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 405	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God Added a link to my blog post about this hero at the top. I decided I wanted to plan, brainstorm and do this hero suggestion as professionally as possible... so if you're interested in the 'Why?' check it out! __________________ CHECK THESE OUT! ... IDOL - HAND OF THE OLD GOD GIROK - TUSKARR PATRIARCH ODIN - RULER OF ASGARD VARMINT - JUNGLE LURKER ... I review back!

01-19-2011, 02:58 PM	#9
Lotus V Eater Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Borneo Island! Posts: 4,806 Blog Entries: 4	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God well, i still don't understand why this hero is a STR hero...when i think he can be an amazing INT carry...well, the current DotA map do lack that kind of role... __________________ :It is no good to try to stop knowledge from going forward. Ignorance is never better than knowledge: Visit My Hero Idea Portfolio I Do Accept Signature Request! LOTUS V EATER'S HOMEMADE ICONS : CHECK IT OUT NOW!

01-20-2011, 11:13 AM	#10
KyonoRocks Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 405	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God I felt that this hero could be strength or intelligence (definitely not agility, it's a freakin statue). For balance reasons, I think making him intelligence would be unwise. He's not intended to be a carry (I don't like carries tbh), so if he was intelligence he could stack intelligence and pump up his attack damage AND his available mana pool. Strength means that he can still stack intelligence (a bit like Earthshaker), but he won't become this absolute monster when he uses his ultimate. The ultimate is primarily meant as a ganking tool. A way to be missing from a lane but the opponent doesn't know it yet. It has a side-function of acting like a very short term 2x damage boost (doubles your attack damage), which serves him late game or in team battles, but my intention for him to be a ganker and not a carry means I had to stick a high mana cost on it. I do agree that intelligence suits him more, in that he has to stack mana if he wants to abuse Omnipresence, so it could be changed. I just feel it would turn him into a carry, when I don't want him to play that role. What is interesting, is when ganking ends at late game, he does kinda fall into that carry role naturally. Being strength, it takes longer, but with the items you'll be getting it's likely that he'll be able to keep Omnipresence active for 10+ seconds if you get 2000 mana and use Forced Tribute. This would be pretty late game though, so he's unique in that he's a super-duper hard carry (in that he needs TONS of items to carry), but he plays a completely different role until that point. __________________ CHECK THESE OUT! ... IDOL - HAND OF THE OLD GOD GIROK - TUSKARR PATRIARCH ODIN - RULER OF ASGARD VARMINT - JUNGLE LURKER ... I review back!

01-20-2011, 11:19 AM	#11
Lotus V Eater Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Borneo Island! Posts: 4,806 Blog Entries: 4	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God hahaha very well-answered indeed....XD i think it is very awesome if you makes your illusion affected by the buffs from your spell as well, as to increase the "believing feeling" of your enemies about the illusion. (ie: when you cast the 2nd skill, and later the ulti, your illusion will gain the 2nd skill buff as well) __________________ :It is no good to try to stop knowledge from going forward. Ignorance is never better than knowledge: Visit My Hero Idea Portfolio I Do Accept Signature Request! LOTUS V EATER'S HOMEMADE ICONS : CHECK IT OUT NOW!

01-20-2011, 11:48 AM	#12
God of Death Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: I'm Posting Below Stupid Posts: 6,250 Blog Entries: 2	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God Yo, awesome concept, cool skills. The only problem I see is with the manastealing; your hero doesn't have low cooldown skills that he can chainspam after stealing mana for 5 seconds. Hence, this leads to a fixed playstyle where you have to cast the third skill first before spamming everything else. Apart from the ultimate. About the ultimate, now, this has potential. A lot of it. Why not dramatically reduce the cooldown, and add a cap on maximum illusions maintainable? Something like 80/60/40 second cooldown for the Blink. After all, it's an ultimate. And just some ideas; how about giving the copy access to all the skills? As in, they share cooldown for the skills, but either can cast. They also share manapools, or share 50% of their manapool [50% of the change in one is reflected in the other]. And IMO needs a reduction in the mana upkeep. Otherwise, this hero is pretty awesome.

01-21-2011, 04:44 PM	#13
KyonoRocks Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 405	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God Thanks for the feedback GoD My problem with any changes to the ultimate is that it changes the role of the hero. The problem with the illusion is that technically it's the strongest illusion creation ability in the game. Even Morphling has a 50% damage reduction on his clone and Terrorblade has a 300% damage taken increase (and 55% damage). The reason for a massive, massive upkeep is so it cannot be used like this... at least until the very late game. Any changes to mana, health or damage intake/output could jeopardize the effectiveness of the clone in its role as deception. I love the idea of having multiple clones, really gives a great thematic feel to Omnipresence (he really is everywhere at all times). But I'm unsure how to do this, and balance it, without spoiling the original intention of the skill; deception. Here's an idea I just got... how about the clones start with 100% damage and stats, but after 5 seconds they convert into paper thin regular illusions. In this way, it works for the deception but also allows me to 'spam' clones and reduce the mana cost because they'll be easily destroyable after a few seconds. Will be complicated to describe, but it might work. The implications of being able to have up to 3 or 4 clones are quite daunting! It would turn him into a mini-Meepo without the risk factor (actually, it would be a Meepo with ALL copied items... like Lone Druid with 3-4 bears!). The micro would be pretty intense, especially if players used the original motivation (deception) and used all their clones to confuse the hell out of the enemy team. Of course, a problem with that would be their use as free wards. Lots of food for thought! More feedback would still be much appreciated! __________________ CHECK THESE OUT! ... IDOL - HAND OF THE OLD GOD GIROK - TUSKARR PATRIARCH ODIN - RULER OF ASGARD VARMINT - JUNGLE LURKER ... I review back!

01-21-2011, 08:47 PM	#14
ExValentine Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Long Beach, CA Posts: 20	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God Although the Ult is really mana heavy (I'm guessing you want him to be a caster of sorts), you could say that Orchid of Malevolence would be crucial in the item build. The oblivion staff that is used to make it is all about mana regen and added damage (a bit of extra attack speed, but that will help Idol too). So, you can gradually increase mana regen while still gaining damage, attack speed and intelligence. Great hero btw. __________________ Current Heroes in Progress: Harlemorte: Death Reaver, Marina Warmaiden - The Flagweaver

01-27-2011, 10:02 AM	#16
KyonoRocks Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 405	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God Thinking about changing the ultimate to be much more castable, expanding the illusion confusion theme. Just bumping to get some more feedback before I do so! Help a brotha out, yo! __________________ CHECK THESE OUT! ... IDOL - HAND OF THE OLD GOD GIROK - TUSKARR PATRIARCH ODIN - RULER OF ASGARD VARMINT - JUNGLE LURKER ... I review back!

01-29-2011, 07:59 PM	#17
Loup Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Brasil Posts: 79	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God Came here to suggest a more "Old Gods" oriented theme, but I don't think I will after being convinced that, for that, you would need to change the whole concept of the hero. But, amazing hero, with incredible gameplay and marvelous abilities. About the ulti, it's hard to say, but I'll think of something. P.S.: I tried to comment at your blog, but it was rejected... I think. Would you take a look on whatever is causing this? __________________

01-30-2011, 04:47 PM	#18
KyonoRocks Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 405	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God Thanks a lot for the kind comments, glad you like the idea. Regarding the blog, weird! I had one comment from some guy called indorser but I've checked the auto-spam box and haven't had anything else. Try again if you like, it should email me when I have to approve a comment. __________________ CHECK THESE OUT! ... IDOL - HAND OF THE OLD GOD GIROK - TUSKARR PATRIARCH ODIN - RULER OF ASGARD VARMINT - JUNGLE LURKER ... I review back!

02-24-2011, 02:09 AM	#20
KyonoRocks Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 405	Re: [STR-NEU] Idol, Hand of the Old God Necro bump! Since it's been almost a month, thought I'd give it one. __________________ CHECK THESE OUT! ... IDOL - HAND OF THE OLD GOD GIROK - TUSKARR PATRIARCH ODIN - RULER OF ASGARD VARMINT - JUNGLE LURKER ... I review back!