[FIX]Ava+Toss exploit

0verp0wer_BR · 10-18-2011, 04:50 PM

I can't really consider it a "combo", at least not the same way I'd consider Force Staff+Remote Mines, Blink+Echo Slam or any other comboes you may remember.
Why not?
Because by mixing the skills I get a result wich wouldn't be available at any other conditions, and won't work with any other hero.

So, how to fix it?

The answer: Mekansm-like mech
1. Unit is in Avalanche AoE
2. (Saving for later)
3. Unit takes damage and stun
4. Unit gets a debuff for 1 second
5. Unit is Tossed and takes all its effects
6. Unit falls on Avalanche AoE again
7. and 2. Check for Debuff mentioned on item 4
8. If debuff is present, unit doesn't take damage/get stunned

Balance numbers if needed.
Discuss

Lama051 · 10-18-2011, 05:50 PM

Well, actually it is bug in code which was labeled as combo so IceFrog would not have to code it again.

Also Tiny would need some serious buffs to be useful

silly_me · 10-18-2011, 05:56 PM

Lol, why? :S The "combo" is really nice and unique. Would suck to take away it. Love them tiny hugz :/

AKBu3nY · 10-18-2011, 06:37 PM

@OP: Fyi it's actually really easy to fix this exploit and I'm pretty sure IceFrog knows that. But he intentionally keeps it. Even in DotA2 it works that way.
T-down.

Nevfigalo · 10-18-2011, 06:55 PM

Toss on its own is so amazing skill that its potential has to be wasted at least partially by forcing people to cast it on tossed unit.

It is not bug = no need of fix.

@down
It is supposed to work like this. Maybe it was a bug...

AKBu3nY · 10-18-2011, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evfeed

It is not bug = no need of fix.

Actually it is a bug...

ImboredxD · 10-18-2011, 07:19 PM

T-Down. He needs this.

laikzasve · 10-18-2011, 07:30 PM

For guys that say that its bug :
When tiny got introduced,if you used ava+toss combo,he got hit by ava numerless times.Later bug was fixed,but players wanted it back(since it was cool),so it became famous ava+toss combo.
Tl;dr : Not bug.
OT: T-down. Ava+toss combo IS tiny.

crinckle · 10-18-2011, 07:34 PM

Evfeed is right. It used to be a bug. Later, the bug was fixed but it was triggered to do the double damage to a tossed unit. So it is completely intended.

Monsterlord · 10-18-2011, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Actually it is a bug...

It's not been a bug for a long time. Ice actually fixed the spell, and coded it so it would work that way more reliably.

AKBu3nY · 10-18-2011, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by laikzasve

For guys that say that its bug :
When tiny got introduced,if you used ava+toss combo,he got hit by ava numerless times.Later bug was fixed,but players wanted it back(since it was cool),so it became famous ava+toss combo.
Tl;dr : Not bug.
OT: T-down. Ava+toss combo IS tiny.

I once read in a post in AM that the current combo is possible through a bug and no one said that that post is actually wrong, so I always though it is a bug. So it's not a bug, but a bug is the reason why the combo today exists. Thanks for clarifying it.

Midas · 10-18-2011, 08:10 PM

It's part of the mechanics :/

Dota_Reaper · 10-18-2011, 08:15 PM

So you want Tiny to be useless in competitive? Nice. Tiny is in a good state right now where I feel he is neither OP nor UP.

0verp0wer_BR · 10-19-2011, 02:05 PM

^ Did you red the last sentence?

"Balance numbers if needed"

So, you're saying I'm nerfing him for reducing his dmg output, right?
OK, but now you can use Toss for something else, not just as an "Avalanche-only-Soul-Catcher".
And I'd consider this a buff...

So, it's just a matter of numbers, right?

The Adversary · 10-19-2011, 11:52 PM

it's not a bug, it's a feature!

melchizedek · 10-20-2011, 01:17 PM

It's just the best part of playing tiny, you can only profit from this combo if you are skilled by placing yourself well in order to toss the hero or if you are lucky. there is so much fun to toss the enemy hero by luck when you are in a wave of creeps

Nutsy · 10-20-2011, 01:21 PM

Most people who don't take time on reading ability tooltips would never know this 'exploit'. So t-down... it's a 'trick'.

Redeemed A.I. · 10-21-2011, 05:36 PM

What bug are you talking about guys, i m confused

silly_me · 10-21-2011, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 0verp0wer_BR

^ Did you red the last sentence?

"Balance numbers if needed"

So, you're saying I'm nerfing him for reducing his dmg output, right?
OK, but now you can use Toss for something else, not just as an "Avalanche-only-Soul-Catcher".
And I'd consider this a buff...

So, it's just a matter of numbers, right?

Are you saying it is a buff because you will increase the dmg of ava/toss? Or, because it can't be used to deal extra dmg now so that you have to use it in a "smart" way. If you mean the second case, I really think the reasoning is stupid. It can't be less useful that a spell sometimes deal more dmg.

JJE92 · 10-21-2011, 08:17 PM

Why would you change that if by doing that you ruin the whole uniqueness Tiny has? Seriously, that's why Tiny has no casting time, because due to this he can nearly instantaneously cast his skills one after another to exploit this combo if done correctly. That's what seperates good Tiny players from bad ones and that's what gives him his instant-kill reputation.

10-18-2011, 04:50 PM	#1
0verp0wer_BR Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Brasil Posts: 1,356 Blog Entries: 10	[FIX]Ava+Toss exploit I can't really consider it a "combo", at least not the same way I'd consider Force Staff+Remote Mines, Blink+Echo Slam or any other comboes you may remember. Why not? Because by mixing the skills I get a result wich wouldn't be available at any other conditions, and won't work with any other hero. So, how to fix it? The answer: Mekansm-like mech 1. Unit is in Avalanche AoE 2. (Saving for later) 3. Unit takes damage and stun 4. Unit gets a debuff for 1 second 5. Unit is Tossed and takes all its effects 6. Unit falls on Avalanche AoE again 7. and 2. Check for Debuff mentioned on item 4 8. If debuff is present, unit doesn't take damage/get stunned Balance numbers if needed. Discuss __________________ My Suggestions My Steam Acc + 0verp0wer_BR

10-18-2011, 05:50 PM	#2
Lama051 Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 5,037 Blog Entries: 1	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit Well, actually it is bug in code which was labeled as combo so IceFrog would not have to code it again. Also Tiny would need some serious buffs to be useful __________________ \/\/ Czech this out\/\/ For solution of hotkey problems of SF and Rubick click here.

10-18-2011, 05:56 PM	#3
silly_me Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,087	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit Lol, why? :S The "combo" is really nice and unique. Would suck to take away it. Love them tiny hugz :/ __________________ Never fear shadows. They simply mean there's a light shining somewhere nearby. Getting sick of pubs.. [Remake] Spirit Lance Sleight of Fist [Tweak] Gem while using Duel Allow Pudge to turn of Rot when silenced [Fix] Holy Persuasion Teleport Veno/Slark Targeting

10-18-2011, 06:37 PM	#4
AKBu3nY Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: .-. Posts: 6,602 Blog Entries: 1	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit @OP: Fyi it's actually really easy to fix this exploit and I'm pretty sure IceFrog knows that. But he intentionally keeps it. Even in DotA2 it works that way. T-down. __________________ . ~♥~~♥~

10-18-2011, 06:55 PM	#5
Nevfigalo Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Europe Posts: 1,154	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit Toss on its own is so amazing skill that its potential has to be wasted at least partially by forcing people to cast it on tossed unit. It is not bug = no need of fix. @down It is supposed to work like this. Maybe it was a bug... __________________ Ability Ideas Hero Ideas Item Ideas Air Drift Quick Toss Lockdown Sithus, the Fallen Seeker Morgan, the Iron Fighter Strutter, the Warmonger Lightbringer

Last edited by Nevfigalo; 10-18-2011 at 07:16 PM.

10-18-2011, 07:19 PM	#7
ImboredxD Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Dream Land Posts: 675	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit T-Down. He needs this.

10-18-2011, 07:30 PM	#8
laikzasve Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Serbia Posts: 2,466	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit For guys that say that its bug : When tiny got introduced,if you used ava+toss combo,he got hit by ava numerless times.Later bug was fixed,but players wanted it back(since it was cool),so it became famous ava+toss combo. Tl;dr : Not bug. OT: T-down. Ava+toss combo IS tiny. __________________ Rebalance of Concussive Shot Fix Bloodseeker being butt-raped by a TP scroll.

10-18-2011, 07:34 PM	#9
crinckle Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Chennai/Pune, India Posts: 1,457	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit Evfeed is right. It used to be a bug. Later, the bug was fixed but it was triggered to do the double damage to a tossed unit. So it is completely intended.

10-18-2011, 08:10 PM	#12
Midas Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 24	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit It's part of the mechanics :/

10-18-2011, 08:15 PM	#13
Dota_Reaper Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 50	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit So you want Tiny to be useless in competitive? Nice. Tiny is in a good state right now where I feel he is neither OP nor UP.

10-19-2011, 02:05 PM	#14
0verp0wer_BR Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Brasil Posts: 1,356 Blog Entries: 10	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit ^ Did you red the last sentence? "Balance numbers if needed" So, you're saying I'm nerfing him for reducing his dmg output, right? OK, but now you can use Toss for something else, not just as an "Avalanche-only-Soul-Catcher". And I'd consider this a buff... So, it's just a matter of numbers, right? __________________ My Suggestions My Steam Acc + 0verp0wer_BR

10-19-2011, 11:52 PM	#15
The Adversary Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: NYC Posts: 35	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit it's not a bug, it's a feature! __________________

10-20-2011, 01:17 PM	#16
melchizedek Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 32	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit It's just the best part of playing tiny, you can only profit from this combo if you are skilled by placing yourself well in order to toss the hero or if you are lucky. there is so much fun to toss the enemy hero by luck when you are in a wave of creeps

10-20-2011, 01:21 PM	#17
Nutsy Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Philippines Posts: 1,989	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit Most people who don't take time on reading ability tooltips would never know this 'exploit'. So t-down... it's a 'trick'. __________________

10-21-2011, 05:36 PM	#18
Redeemed A.I. Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Greece.Μακεδονία Posts: 8,675	Re: [FIX]Ava+Toss exploit What bug are you talking about guys, i m confused