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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Malkut, Yesod, Keter
Posts: 159
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![]() Toxic Wave Active: Ranged Nuke/Disable Cast Range: 800 AoE (width): 250 "The Primordial Ooze hurls a wave of it's own substance into the eyes of it's foes, temporarily obscuring their vision, and causing searing pain due to the corrosive nature of it's form" Level 1 - Causes an 24% blind that reduces by 4% per second over 6 seconds. Deals 45 damage on impact, and deals 10 damage per second. (Blind per second: 24%, 20%, 16%, 12%, 8%, 4%, 00%) Costs 85 mana and 45 health. Total damage: 105 Level 2 - Causes an 36% blind that reduces by 4% per second over 6 seconds. Deals 55 damage on impact, and deals 18 damage per second. (Blind per second: 36%, 32%, 28%, 24%, 20%, 16%, 00%) Costs 95 mana and 55 health. Total damage: 163 Level 3 - Causes an 48% blind that reduces by 4% per second over 6 seconds. Deals 65 damage on impact, and deals 26 damage per second. (Blind per second: 48%, 44%, 40%, 36%, 32%, 28%, 00%) Costs 105 mana and 65 health. Total damage: 221 Level 4 - Causes an 60% blind that reduces by 4% per second over 6 seconds. Deals 75 damage on impact, and deals 34 damage per second. (Blind per second: 60%, 56%, 52%, 48%, 44%, 40%, 00%) Costs 115 mana and 75 health. Total damage: 281 Cooldown: 12 seconds. Damage Type: Magical |
![]() Leeching Viscera Active: Demobilizer/Lifedrain Extending a grotesque tentacle, the Primordial Ooze latches on to an unfortunate creature and begins draining it's life force for sustainance. The creature, though still able to move, cannot escape the clutch of the tentacle until the Primordial Ooze has had it's fill. Level 1 - Absorbs 25 health per second, lasts 3 seconds. Has a casting range of 500. Maximum distance allowed between PO and its target: 700. Costs 105 mana. Level 2 - Absorbs 40 health per second, lasts 3 seconds. Has a casting range of 500. Maximum distance allowed between PO and its target: 600. Costs 125 mana. Level 3 - Absorbs 55 health per second, lasts 3 seconds. Has a casting range of 500. Maximum distance allowed between PO and its target: 500. Costs 145 mana. Level 4 - Absorbs 70 health per second, lasts 3 seconds. Has a casting range of 500. Maximum distance allowed between PO and its target: 400 (pulls them back slightly). Costs 165 mana. Damage type: Pure Cooldown: 12 seconds While entangled, both the Primordial Ooze and it's target are able to move - HOWEVER - neither can be separated by a distance greater than the length of the tentacle. Neither unit has "priority" and the ability to drag the other. Both will be forced to stop if the link reaches its maximum distance. Primordial Ooze is able to attack the unit while it is entangled. Stunning will not end the spell, though it will hold the Primordial Ooze in place. Blinking will end the spell. |
![]() Gelatinous Mass Passive: Summon/Evasive Alive in ways not easily understood, the Primordial Ooze exists as a composite entity - comprised of a multitude of smaller Oozes working in tandem to survive. As the Primordial Ooze is damaged, the links holding it together weaken, and individual Oozes will detach to try and survive on their own. This loss of its parts causes the Primordial Ooze to shrink in size, though not in potency. All levels: The Primordial Ooze will shrink in relation to it's total health - 1% smaller for each 1% health missing, until it is half it's starting size. Diminished size includes diminished collision size. Level 1 - Spawns a Lesser Ooze for each cumulative 10% life lost. (90%, 80%, 70%, 60%, 50%) For each Lesser Ooze spawned Primordial Ooze loses 8% of its max damage. Level 2 - Spawns an Ooze for each cumulative 9% life lost. (91%, 82%, 73%, 64%, 55%) For each Ooze spawned Primordial Ooze loses 7% of its max damage. Level 3 - Spawns a Greater Ooze for each cumulative 8% life lost. (92%, 84%, 76%, 68%, 60%) For each Greater Ooze spawned Primordial Ooze loses 6% of its max damage. Level 4 - Spawns a Dire Ooze for each cumulative 7% life lost. (93%, 86%, 79%, 72%, 65%) For each Dire Ooze spawned Primordial Ooze loses 5% of its max damage. Quote:
At 92% of his maximum health, he spawns a Greater Ooze. If he then heals back to full health, he will need to drop all the way to 84% before he spawns his next Greater Ooze. From there, he gets hit by a nuke and drops all the way to 68% health - he spawns 2 Greater Oozes. Then one Ooze dies. His next Ooze will spawn at 68% health. Regarding damage, think about it this way: At level 1 Gelatinous Mass, if Primordial Ooze has all 5 Oozes Spawned, it will have only 60% of it's starting damage (as it loses 8% per Ooze, and spawned 5 (5x8 = 40%)) however, each Ooze deals 15% of Primordial Ooze's base damage, so (5 x 15% = 75%) the Primordial Ooze and other Oozes make a combined attack total of 135%. This benefit gets diminished somewhat by the fact that each individual attack gets reduced by armor. At level 4, the Primordial Ooze will attack at only 75% of its damage (5 Oozes at 5% damage = 25%) but with each Ooze attacking at 30% (5 x 30% = 150%) the combined attack total will make 225% (although each attack gets reduced individually by armor) |
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Ultimate: Expunge AoE Nuke/Disable (Centered on Primordial Ooze) "In a quivvering spasm, the Primordial Ooze unleashes a concentrated blast of it's biomass, completely clouding the vision of all those caught in the blast" Level 1 - Deals 50 damage in an AoE of 350 and adds the "Obfuscate" debuff to each target hit. (Obfuscate removes allied vision and reduces sight range by 100 units. Stacks up to six times and lasts 5 seconds). Costs 70 mana and 40 health. Level 2 - Deals 80 damage in an AoE of 425 and adds the "Obfuscate" debuff to each target hit. (Obfuscate removes allied vision and reduces sight range by 125 units. Stacks up to six times and lasts 5 seconds). Costs 90 mana and 55 health. Level 3 - Deals 110 damage in an AoE of 500 and adds the "Obfuscate" debuff to each target hit. (Obfuscate removes allied vision and reduces sight range by 150 units. Stacks up to six times and lasts 5 seconds). Costs 100 mana and 70 health. Obfuscate's duration resets each time the ability is stacked Cooldown: 3 seconds (can be Autocast) Damage Type: Magical |
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#2 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Malkut, Yesod, Keter
Posts: 159
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Suggested Items include:
Armlet of Mordiggian - Increase in STR makes Oozes more powerful, continuous life drain makes spawning Oozes easier. Necronomicon - Manaburn and two attacking units work exceedingly well with Leeching Viscera. Additional mana is useful, but the STR gain is what's really worth it. Heart of Terrasque - STRoids. Vanguard - The additional health means your oozes spawned have higher health, helps to survive since part of playing the Primordial Ooze means keeping your own life total on the lower end of the spectrum. Radiance - DPS. Bloodstone - HPs. Stygian Desolator - Each of your Oozes contributes to what would make a higher than starting damage pool - however, each individual attack is subject to reduction due to armor. Stygian Desolator is as effective as it is brutal. Almost a must have. Eye of Skadi - Stats, health, slow. Again, essential. Assault Cuirass - Reducing Armor Aura does just what you want with the Stygian, the increased attackspeed aura is frightning with your mass of units. Linken's Sphere - No Laguna Blade! Sange & Yasha - Sorely needed increased movement speed, increased attackspeed + maim, and STR boost. Allies include: Drow and Luna (ranged damage increase auras) Dirge (thanks Olane93) Any effective disabler. Anyone who needs an effective disabler. |
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| Last edited by Singhilarity; 10-27-2009 at 06:00 PM. | |
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#3 | |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: As aussie as a meat pie with sauce.
Posts: 125
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One question what is the ms of the ooze?
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![]() Check out my hero suggestion:Naxxramus, the city of the damned. It is a nice use of a completely forgotten model that can easily fit in DotA and perhaps even belongs there. ![]() moved to HoN until dota 2 comes out, so no reviews, will still lurk though. Quote:
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#4 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Malkut, Yesod, Keter
Posts: 159
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Excellent question, H. I had completely intended to put it in and then forgot.
Given that he's a quite considerable STR hero, with a ranged attack, I think 295 is appropriate. Perhaps even slower. Updated and appreciated. |
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#5 |
Member
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What's the role of your hero anyways?
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#6 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Malkut, Yesod, Keter
Posts: 159
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That's a good question.
First and foremost, I suppose, he kills heroes, but he certainly plays as a DPS tank. His health is no slouch, and as he loses it (sometimes voluntarily) the mass of units attacking, paired with his ability to (somewhat) hold units in place (also a life drain, to prolong combat), with a powerful orb effect can make for a thoroughly unpleasant experience to be on the recieving end of. The fact that he has an AoE nuke which both slows and blinds can make him somewhat of an asset in team fights, and in evasion if need be. Obfuscate alone, I imagine (I've never seen it coded, but I'm sure it's possible) when stacked six times, will provide a hero with a frightfully claustrophobic time, which can panic new players, confuse experienced ones, and at very least keep them guessing (Are my allies going to show up? Holy moses, there's the ramp to get into the river... is anyone coming up the ramp?! AAAAAGH!). Especially if their vision shrinks below the range that they can see you at. (Remember that ranged attack?) Also - how can they buff an ally they can't see? While he may not support his team *directly* via buffing, he is consistent enough with constant damage output (including from his minions) and the AoE which can effectively grant your whole team evasion (via blind), he's capable of holding his own whether jungling, in a solo, or team fight. It's essential to note also, that as he shrinks, his collision size should reduce accordingly. |
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#7 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Malkut, Yesod, Keter
Posts: 159
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Major question:
Should the Oozes be limited to staying within a certain proximity of the Primordial Ooze (essentially turning him into a large attack squadron as his health diminishes) or should they be allowed freedom of movement. They can act very similar to Revenants if allowed freedom of movement, and they come from a basic skill not an ultimate. On the other hand, Revenants fly, reduce armor, and do more damage. Also; currently as written, Oozes do not disappear as the Primordial Ooze regains health. Should they? If so, I feel they should be slightly more powerful. Opinions would be most welcome. |
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| Last edited by Singhilarity; 09-29-2009 at 04:03 AM. | |
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#8 |
Member
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His role is a solo ganker/caster/support(First Skill&Ultimate). but he's STR, which is weird. can you explain why is it STR?
i like the perma pets. overall, pretty good hero. didnt really understood Ultimate.
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#9 |
Member
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Ultimate is pretty good IMO. However I do suggest you change your icons since they are already in use such as in the case of Obfuscate.
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#10 |
Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 84
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The Concept is brilliant, well done.
You should think about the ulti one more time, it seems pretty strong atm, I would even say a bit OP. However, great concept, T-up.
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98% of the forum plays the tag game. If you are one of the 2% who dont put this in your signature.
Kaarogan, Centaur Outlaw. Great Suggestion , review pls.>>>>PM me for reviews and icons<<<< |
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#11 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Malkut, Yesod, Keter
Posts: 159
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Abyss: He's designed as a STR hero for multiple reasons;
Primarily, as a hero who has a skillset which partly relies on taking damage, it's important that he has a large ammount of health, and it's important for him to be able to recover it quickly with basic regen. That he will have substantial health allows Expunge and Obfuscate to become slightly more powerful (they are both extremely powerful skills), at the added cost of them costing him health - with the added bonus that this then synergizes directly with Gelatinous Mass. Keeping his agility low, and providing no real benefit to boosting it, allows his armor to remain in balance with the rest of his abilities - and while he can always use more attack speed, it's not as essential in this case because of the miniature oozes which he spawns. As an Intelligence based hero, he simply never acquires enough benefit to his health to play effectively. ReichFurher - The icons are of no real concern to me, though I appreciate your suggestion. I got them directly from Classic.Battle.net/War3, where I know I can find the complete set (except for Creep Portraits - hence the animation displayed). Why? Because first and foremost my intention is to get the idea across, in as concise a manner as possible. Adding another 2 hours to getting the post prepared for something which is purely cosmetic for a webpost is the least of my concerns. I know that they're in use already, but, should - *knocks on wood* - the Primordial Ooze be implimented into DotA, I'm sure the icons would change. Cedeo^2 - The ultimate is indeed powerful. The most effective ways to balance it without upsetting the ability too much would be a slight damage reduction (10 - 20 points across the board) and adding a minor cooldown. If the cooldown increases, though, the duration of the effect needs to increase, and I think 3 seconds is plenty. Keeping the cooldown low also makes it easier to drain your own life away carelessly - something I'm a fan of doing to the unwary. |
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#12 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Poland (Poznań)
Posts: 44
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Are the 1st and Ultimate self-lethal skills? BTW ulti won`t remove any attacking units from sightrange - you`ll be still visible when attacking. It`s the similar effect like with attacks from higher terrain.
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#13 |
Forum Staff
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I'm REALLY impressed. The general idea of the hero is very well designed, and its execution attuned to it.
I have a few queries related to the specific mechanics of the skills, though. Namely: Leeching Viscera: How does the maximum distance restriction works? Is it calculated based on the position of both heroes (so both restrict each other mutually), or only one (so if the OP moves to the right, he drags the hero with him)? Gelatinous mass: What are the mechanics behind the spawning of the lesser oozes? Because I fear a possible abuse. What I though is that, based on the max HP of the OP, a specific number is set as a "trigger number" (a fraction of his HP corresponding to the level of the skill), which when met (or below) spawns a lesser ooze. Is this what you have in mind? If it is, there's one problem: Users calculating this "trigger number", and then going to neutral camps with a set of Tangoes. Once there, they let the neutral creeps hit them just the necessary to spawn a lesser ooze, then proceed to recover 20-30 HP with the Tango and let the creeps hit them again (rinse & repeat). Based on that, I think perhaps a safer mechanic would be to make the oozes spawn on damage received; even when it will still be technically possible to do what I mentioned above, it will be definitely harder, more time-consuming and more expensive. Let me know your thoughts on this. ----------- You know, I personally love the effect of the ultimate (the allied-vision lost), but I'm not sure if putting it in an Orb Effect is the proper way to utilize it. That being said, allow me to share with you a thought I had: Basically, merging Expunge and Obfuscate. The result is the following: An ultimate that works like Expunge (A Poison-nova like attack, originating from the hero) but that not only damages, but also removes allied vision, in addition to reducing the normal sight range of the hero (A little MS reduction could be kept). With that, this hero could wreak real havoc on team-battles if it uses it correctly, the skill also working as a reliable ganking tool. I have yet to find a proper replacement for the first skill (if the above idea was to be considered), but I'm sharing the general idea with you for now. But as I've said, in its current state, the hero quite appeals to me. Nicely done. |
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| Last edited by Jenova-; 09-29-2009 at 04:02 PM. | |
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#14 |
Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 5,601
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i liek, t-up.
only thing i think you should do different are the oozes. make them have a timer but no limit or a bigger limit. this way stuff like meks, heart and life steal can be uber leet on him. |
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#15 |
Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,717
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I just realised, that i made my ulti on Wyvern, almsot exactly likeyour. I'm sorry, but i have to say that i did NOT steal the idea, just saw it. Will put you in my credits
![]() Anyways, i like it, it have good synergy with all except ultimate? It have no IAS increase, and the sight is no good agaisnt you specific anyways. I like the concept, but don't know if it fits in. |
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#16 |
Member
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I've would added Dirge maybe as ally, hes soul rip works nice with the hp lost and unit increased skill to your hero. Anyway looks like a fun hero
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#17 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Malkut, Yesod, Keter
Posts: 159
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Thank you all for the support, your comments and your feedback;
Infiriel - that's a very good point, indeed I had forgotten that they'd get sight of attacking creatures. Nevertheless, a devastating skill. Abyss Petra, to whom I did not fully respond the first time; His ultimate works like this. The first shot removes all allied vision from the unit who gets hit. This means they have Fog of War where they used to be able to see thanks to: buildings in the base and creeps or heroes anywhere on the map. They can still see their Circle of Power, as it is not allied controlled but controlled by them. Same goes for Animal Courriers. Their maximum line of sight also gets reduced by 100/125/150 "units", an effect which stacks 6 times, to a maximum of 600/725/900. The average sight range of a hero is 1800 during the day and 800 during the night. Hit at night, Obfuscate could render them *completely* blind except for their own little sphere. During the day, it cuts their maximum sight range in half. (I will consider tweaking this to have it be not so thoroughly exploitative at night) Jenova- - Thought provoking questions! YES! Leeching Viscera is calculated on both heroes mutually as they move around. Neither can move further than 700/600/500/400 units apart. If you go one way, and they go another, no one goes anywhere. I had a test map on a different computer that Nikklausi (sp?) coded (without the life drain) and it works *beautifully*. Gelatinous mass - Point duly noted and ability corrected. They now spawn at consecutively lower life totals. See the main post. I think your idea to merge Expunge and Obfuscate certainly has merit as an alternative to the hero as presented. I'm obviously very fond of my baby, slimy though he is, but I can appreciate a good idea when I see one. I haven't thought of a first ability that would be fitting either (although a basic "DPS + Blind effect which if cast on self instantly spawns an ooze came to mind, but it's kinda shallow and forced) I'll keep my mind running, and if I can think of a very viable alternative, will post the alternate version below the original. Thank you for your review and support. Doomsheep - I appreciate the suggestion, but I'm going to keep the ability as written. I kind of like the idea of having personal Oozes. Since there are only 7 of them (I nerfed it down one and gave them all a bit more health - you still have 8 units, including yourself) you can give them all names... "That one's Skippy, and here's Jerome, say hello, Samson... DELILAH KEEP YOUR HANDS TO YOURSELF!... etc." Of course, since I clarified how I had intended for the ability to trigger, and have since reworked it slightly (thank you kindly Jenova-) it is now also impossible for the ability to work as you've suggested. Still, thank you. No worries about the skill-pilfering Sarg, it's the nature of the game. The Ultimate synergizes thusly - 1 - It costs health, this means you're spawning units as you use it. 2 - By blinding the enemy, it makes it far more confusing where to run, this means that you've got a far better chance of hitting them with your minor army. 3 - It deals extra damage, which, when paired with a slow (expunge) means you don't need to worry about them escaping. |
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#18 | ||
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Malkut, Yesod, Keter
Posts: 159
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Ok, contemplation time.
I've thought a lot about Jenova-'s suggestion to merge Expunge and Obfuscate, and it strikes me that the Primordial Ooze might become a lot more helpful to a team with a set up similar to this. More AoE seems to be the trend in general (Sven's Stormbolt being a great example) and it's easy to see why - each hero pulls their own weight a lot more. With that in mind, what do people think of the following reworking; Quote:
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| Last edited by Singhilarity; 10-02-2009 at 05:59 PM. | |||
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#19 |
Member
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Review as per request.
One thing first; Is his name Primordial the Ooze or Primordial Ooze the _____ ? Expunge is like an insta-rot, slow and blind. Nothing special about this skill, although would be quite effective when HoT is bought. 2nd skill is soul steal/life drain without channeling. I do not like this skill at all, people have been bitching how bad SS is and giving them a non-channeling won't exactly give them better results. Any explanations on this would be taken for why you gave this skill to PO, then I can take a second look.Now this is the one and only summon spell that really appeals to me. Damn. Excellent concept on releasing a "gelatinous" form whenever you lose a % of life. Now I see good synergy with the first skill, but anti-synergy with the 2nd. Dirge's zombies remind me of the kill-heal infused with this. Good skill overall. I will only comment of Obfuscate, and although the concept of removing allied vision is new and unique, although it doesn't fit PO. I don't see synergy here with any of the skills. Maybe a remake with the 2nd skill will make this much more viable. Overall, the hero is good, but will require some work to stand up to its potential. Granted the Ooze model is great and unseen in DotA, and will make its appearance to the game, but the 2nd skill/4th skill entirely don't seem like skills that would get in with PO into the game. I think the best way to improve your idea is to focus with the 3rd skill onwards, how it helps you out, the summons I mean, give the summons some survivability, like more HP when you have them around or AS/MS when they're around, but don't make it too forced. If you need any help or have any concerns about my review, just give me a ring. Good luck. ![]() king_james |
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#20 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Malkut, Yesod, Keter
Posts: 159
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No commentary on the alternate set up, king_james?
It is likely that they will replace the current skillset. It is simply "The Primordial Ooze" (as the history states; without name or alliegance, the Primordial Ooze represents the most basic of instincts: Eat!) Keep in mind that both Expunge and Obfuscate exist to help generate more Oozes, as Toxic Wave and Clinging Darkness would, and this plays an essential role in his style. Despite the fairly low health of his Oozes, the number of them, and how easily they're replaced (with your skills) makes them a continous threat without any skills that become dangerously close to forced synergy. There are plenty of items for that. Leeching Viscera is dangerous, and also too powerful as written (numerically). It's important to note, though, that the Primordial Ooze itself is limited by the skill and unable to move further than 700/600/500/400 units away. I disagree strongly that it has opposite synergy, however, as it is extremely necessary for the Primordial Ooze to have the ability to heal itself after voluntarily lowering it's life so far. Obfuscate as designed is more of a confusion tactic and damage increase to help spawn more oozes, make escape tricky (from a mass of attackers) and support the rest of the team. Again, I am more inclined towards the second skillset, in which Expunge and Obfuscate merge to become something of a nightmarish "Pulse Nova" and Expunge is replaced with Toxic Wave - a similar blind and hurt (necessary for generating, and keeping the Oozes alive via evasion) but in a more effective format. |
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